Other Shiny new toys

[Classical]

There is the obligatory Flare Blitz Flareon mention, but I don't understand the hype behind it. It'll certainly be a strong Pokemon in the lower tiers but it's too slow and frail to make much use of it. It's time that people realized that even with an improving movepool and a great ability, it's poor stat distribution that hurts the black sheep of the Eevee family most. Jolteon is proof that if something has good stats but shallow movepool, players will make something work.

I can see Power Up Punch becoming a useful addition to the brood of Technician Pokemon's arsenal, namely Hitmontop and Breloom. Yes, Breloom gets SD but STAB might make Power Up Punch worthwhile to use. Cinccino and Ambipom may appreciate it too if they end up getting it.

Right, but we can probably confirm the changed stats based on the differences in stats between old and new pokemon.
And Flare Blitz Flareon is miserable, it is like Pikachu in that it is powerful and will kill itself with ease. Of course, Pikachu uses his item for that, while Flareon uses its item AND ability and he's slower, so make of that what you will.

You guys just don't understand it. Gamefreak is going out of it's way to correct it's wrongs.

Let's not create obscene power creep every Gen
Let's Stop Dragons from being beyond OP
Let's make some bad mons good again
Let's be aware of the balancing issues some pokemon have


And above all. Flareon. Who has suffered endlessly since the beginning of pokemon of having no good stab to go with it's decent attack stat. IT finally gets flare blitz. I mean it had flare in it's name. But the prevous people at troll freak. Decided it would be funny to make him sad. BUT NO LONGER!

 

[Bummer]

There is the obligatory Flare Blitz Flareon mention, but I don't understand the hype behind it. It'll certainly be a strong Pokemon in the lower tiers but it's too slow and frail to make much use of it. It's time that people realized that even with an improving movepool and a great ability, it's poor stat distribution that hurts the black sheep of the Eevee family most. Jolteon is proof that if something has good stats but shallow movepool, players will make something work.

I was counting the hours until someone was to bring it up. But it is just as you say, the lack of Flare Blitz alone wasn't the only reason to Flareon's downfall, so even with this long awaited nuke, he'll probably remain in NU. Its power is very, very real however, where every NU wall not named Alomomola is 2HKO'd. If no one else writes it up I just might, but its low base HP, weakness to Stealth Rock, Toxic Orb and recoil wearing it down, and being vulnerable one turn as it uses Flame Charge are all reasons why Flareon won't live long when it's fired up, so it's difficult to expect more than two KO's from its rampage.

 

[ogasian]

Kinda like Darmanitan or Rampardos, I guess.

 

[Mattman324]

Kinda like Darmanitan or Rampardos, I guess.

Except Flareon is slower, and while Rampardos has a lot of HP (which helps him somewhat, and means he CAN use Head Smash somewhat), Flareon is worse.

Actually, Darmanitan's existence hurts Flareon more than anything else, because he's better in everything except straight Flare Blitz power.

 

[pepiux]

I'm wondering about the new move Boomburst. It seems like a wonderful addition, yet I'm really curious about which other Pokemon will get it, as so far only Exploud receives STAB on it. Chatot, Wigglytuff and Meloetta seem likely candidates to receive it, and would certainly put it to good use within their respective tiers. Now if somehow they decided to give it to the Porygon line...

 

[Slheyas]

Chatot with Boomburst could be REALLY scary as it gets Nasty Plot.

Paper thin defenses and mediocre speed though.

 

[ryan]

The mention of Rampardos makes me wonder why we're even discussing Flareon. High powered STAB in combination with great Attack don't automatically make a Pokemon viable. It's a huge factor of typing, movepool, typing, abilities, and more, and Flareon lacks in very similar ways that Rampardos does; low Speed, huge recoil to their STABs (and Flareon's poison damage if running Toxic Orb + Guts), exploitable weaknesses, etc. Even without these drawbacks, Flareon would still face competition from other offensive Fire-types, including Arcanine, Darmanitan, Victini, etc. I just don't really see any reason to use it, even with Flare Blitz, outside of lower tiers.

 

[Micanis]

I'm wondering about the new move Boomburst. It seems like a wonderful addition, yet I'm really curious about which other Pokemon will get it, as so far only Exploud receives STAB on it. Chatot, Wigglytuff and Meloetta seem likely candidates to receive it, and would certainly put it to good use within their respective tiers. Now if somehow they decided to give it to the Porygon line...

Smeargle technically also gets STAB boomburst, but its SpaAtt is pitiful.

 

[DDRMaster]

There is the obligatory Flare Blitz Flareon mention, but I don't understand the hype behind it. It'll certainly be a strong Pokemon in the lower tiers but it's too slow and frail to make much use of it. It's time that people realized that even with an improving movepool and a great ability, it's poor stat distribution that hurts the black sheep of the Eevee family most. Jolteon is proof that if something has good stats but shallow movepool, players will make something work.

I can see Power Up Punch becoming a useful addition to the brood of Technician Pokemon's arsenal, namely Hitmontop and Breloom. Yes, Breloom gets SD but STAB might make Power Up Punch worthwhile to use. Cinccino and Ambipom may appreciate it too if they end up getting it.

Yeah the main problem with Flareon is the fact that it still doesn't make better use of Flare Blitz than Entei or Arcanine. Both have higher speed, HP, and much better movepools. Wish and Baton Pass are really its only ways of differentiating itself. The former would likely still be better with a Lava Plume/Toxic (or Heal Bell)/Wish/Protect while the latter isn't great on Flareon because it can only pass Flame Charge boosts.

 

[skies]

Unconfirmed because we have no way of knowing, but if Milotic is indeed Fairy it just got a huge buff. Step aside Azumarill, ou is waiting for you Milotic.

 

[Ultimathunder]

Fairy type already have very few pokemon, so I don't see why gamefreak would make some fairy types unaccessible without transferring from older games.

 

[skies]

Fairy type already have very few pokemon, so I don't see why gamefreak would make some fairy types unaccessible without transferring from older games.

Very true, but imagine how great it would be if it got it.

 

[Ultimathunder]

Very true, but imagine how great it would be if it got it.

Well it would be gaining one extra weakness (which isn't a great type anyway) and a neutrality to steel which is ok, and gaining resistances to bug, fighting, and dark and an immunity to dragon. coupled with marvel scale, recover, and good defences (and decent offence), yeah it will probably be OU.

One thing I have a problem with is its comparatively poor defence, while most type moves, ie crunch, close combat will be physical. I guess marvel scale sort of makes up for this?

Also this is unrelated but what pokes resist the combo of fairy and ground? they has pretty good coverage together.

 

[skies]

Well it would be gaining one extra weakness (which isn't a great type anyway) and a neutrality to steel which is ok, and gaining resistances to bug, fighting, and dark and an immunity to dragon. coupled with marvel scale, recover, and good defences (and decent offence), yeah it will probably be OU.

One thing I have a problem with is its comparatively poor defence, while most type moves, ie crunch, close combat will be physical. I guess marvel scale sort of makes up for this?

Also this is unrelated but what pokes resist the combo of fairy and ground? they has pretty good coverage together.

The only resists are Shedinja, Fire/Flying Types, Skarmory, and Crobat

 

[Chou Toshio]

The mention of Rampardos makes me wonder why we're even discussing Flareon. High powered STAB in combination with great Attack don't automatically make a Pokemon viable. It's a huge factor of typing, movepool, typing, abilities, and more, and Flareon lacks in very similar ways that Rampardos does; low Speed, huge recoil to their STABs (and Flareon's poison damage if running Toxic Orb + Guts), exploitable weaknesses, etc. Even without these drawbacks, Flareon would still face competition from other offensive Fire-types, including Arcanine, Darmanitan, Victini, etc. I just don't really see any reason to use it, even with Flare Blitz, outside of lower tiers.

The hype around Flare Blitz Flareon isn't about anticipation, it's about exoneration. Lol. Justice is served!


I don't think anyone actually expects Flareon to be good, but let us enjoy the moment. Lol

Btw, Flareon's name and Flare Blitz share nothing in common in the Japanese games

 

[Gerard]

Unconfirmed because we have no way of knowing, but if Milotic is indeed Fairy it just got a huge buff. Step aside Azumarill, ou is waiting for you Milotic.

It's been confirmed that Milotic remains pure water :(

 

[sidakarya]

I wonder if Meloetta's Relic Song goes through Substitute also? That would be very interesting.

 

[Innanetape1534]

I don't see why people don't use Physical Nidoking more
Sure the icebeam/thunder bolt etc are more powerful moves but it does have a higher attack stat
Nidoking (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Jolly Nature
- Fire Punch
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab

Physical Nido willl probably see alot more usage this gen, especially with all the specially defensive mons introduced such as Sylveon and Goodra

Especially with the main special moves getting BP nerfed physical Nidoking will be low OU I believe

 

[Chou Toshio]

Nidoking is not making OU any time soon-- it's too frail, too slow, and too many exploitable weaknesses. The slight bump to its ATK will keep people on their toes though, and Poison Jab could see new use with all the fairies running around.

For the most part, overall people are right that a 10 point boost to ATK isn't going to stop Special Nido from being almost completely better.

 

[skies]

It's been confirmed that Milotic remains pure water :(

Really? Proof?

 

[Zog]

Really? Proof?

It's fightable in restaurant le wow, I've tested myself and it isn't immune to dragon attacks

 

[Snoopy]

I don't see why people don't use Physical Nidoking more
Sure the icebeam/thunder bolt etc are more powerful moves but it does have a higher attack stat
Nidoking (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
Jolly Nature
- Fire Punch
- Ice Punch
- Earthquake
- Poison Jab

Physical Nido willl probably see alot more usage this gen, especially with all the specially defensive mons introduced such as Sylveon and Goodra

Physical Nidoking isn't very viable because the special will be hitting harder most of the time, however if Game Freak gave it Gunk Shot this gen it can run a very viable mixed set which can net 2HKOs on RestTalk Lax and Umbreon as well as very nearly getting a 2HKO on Chansey, Poison Jab's 80BP just isn't worth it.

Nidoking (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SpA / 4 Atk
Naive Nature
- Earth Power
- Ice Beam
- Fire Blast / Thunderbolt
- Gunk Shot

 

[RotomPoison]

C+C placeholder

 

[Classical]

The hype around Flare Blitz Flareon isn't about anticipation, it's about exoneration. Lol. Justice is served!


I don't think anyone actually expects Flareon to be good, but let us enjoy the moment. Lol

Btw, Flareon's name and Flare Blitz share nothing in common in the Japanese games

^ This guy gets it. And didn't know that about the name.

Anyway, I'm excited to see exploud in lower tiers with boomburst. It gets that beautiful normal type t/m pool, and finally has a truly spammable stab.

 

[Spoderman]

Smeargle technically also gets STAB boomburst, but its SpaAtt is pitiful.

To lazy to read rest of the thread so sorry if someone already said this, but is also gets shell smash which could help make his sp.atk on the verge of mediocre