CAP 3 CAP 3 - Part 9.5 (Main/Secondary Ability Poll)

[Helios]

A thought; why not make green house decrease the speed of this pokemon (by say a level) when the sun is out in addition to the 5 turn thing, since this is a lizard; lizards don't do much moving around when they first get out into the sun.

Hmm, playing off the tribal grass skirt and stuff (and sort of explaining away why it can't learn HP, although a better explaination could probably be found);
WOODMANs are highly superstitious and abhor any type of strange power. Many will become spooked at the sight of pokemon such as WEEZING

Btw, hypnosis and focus blast have grudges against me; I think I eated their cookies.

 

[Jace the Mind Sculptor]

It's one of these abilities that gets a lot of votes from what I see, so I voted as to have a shot at stopping Green House. I think physical sets are kind of a waste on Woodman, especially taking into account that Hippowdon can actually wall it to a huge extent if you go physical.

Battle Armor pleases the folks that always whine about luck. I'm not one of them (in fact, I hate people who pretend they're always getting luckfucked), but this gives them an excuse to actually prevent those CHs instead of whining that they don't want to use Armaldo or Cloyster.

It's a shame then that bangwagon followers and hax whiners are ruining this pokemon (nothing personal against anyone).

Lets say Sunflora had the bulk of this pokemon. If it did, then Sunny Day would definately be considerable. However, Sunflora is not only slow as shit, but is terribly not defensive. Tropius isnt much better. You see, an ability as powerful as Solar Power can only work if the pokemon is fast or bulky enough to take a hit and dish it back. Well, how defensive is Woodman again? Exactly!

Honestly, there wont ever be a situation where Solar Power fits on a Pokemon more than it does now. And don't forget that Woodman's SpAtk is only 95 (mind you it is high enough to actually 2hko something yet low enough to prevent ohkos).

Everyone who votes for an ability must think about why exactly are they voting for the ability and how does it benefit from this pokemon. Rock Head doesn't give enough of a benefit to even be considered as an ability and Battle Armor is oen fo those abilities that you cannot quantify its effectiveness because its just so stale. >_<

 

[X-Act]

Sunflora...Tropius...Solar Power...

You have to admit that if Sunflora or Tropius were Grass/Fire instead of Grass only or Grass/Flying, they'd be much better Pokemon with Solar Power. They might even be remotely viable, come to think of it.

I didn't vote for Solar Power for exactly the reason you said. It fits the Pokemon... too much. An extreme case of an ability that would fit Spiritomb exactly is Wonder Guard. Scrappy Pokemon and Foresight/Odor Sleuth Pokemon still hit it, but of course it would be madness to give Spiritomb Wonder Guard, right?

 

[Rena22]

Main: Battle Armor
Secondary: Sniper

 

[Lil Ant]

Actually Tropius tankiness probably isn't far from Skarmory's. I don't know how to work X-Act little chart thing. X-Act would you mind doing that

99 HP
83 Defense
87 Special Defense

 

[Hazmat]

It's a shame then that bangwagon followers and hax whiners are ruining this pokemon (nothing personal against anyone).

Lets say Sunflora had the bulk of this pokemon. If it did, then Sunny Day would definately be considerable. However, Sunflora is not only slow as shit, but is terribly not defensive. Tropius isnt much better. You see, an ability as powerful as Solar Power can only work if the pokemon is fast or bulky enough to take a hit and dish it back. Well, how defensive is Woodman again? Exactly!

Honestly, there wont ever be a situation where Solar Power fits on a Pokemon more than it does now. And don't forget that Woodman's SpAtk is only 95 (mind you it is high enough to actually 2hko something yet low enough to prevent ohkos).

Everyone who votes for an ability must think about why exactly are they voting for the ability and how does it benefit from this pokemon. Rock Head doesn't give enough of a benefit to even be considered as an ability and Battle Armor is oen fo those abilities that you cannot quantify its effectiveness because its just so stale. >_<

Of course it fits woodman, IT FITS HIM TOO WELL. Personally, I wanted another stat spread, but most people wanted M&A's. I have no problem with that, but their stat spread was so damn careful and well thought out you guys are just throwing it to the wayside. All of the checks and balances that went in to convincing people that it wasn't overpowered are being hit with a sun+solar boosted FB. Safe abilities that don't screw with the checks are what I figured S&A wanted, otherwise people get their stat cake - and get to eat it too. Not that that's a bad thing, it's just that all of the work they did is being compromised.

 

[omnitarian]

Leaf Guard is the only sun-based ability that wouldn't be too much.
Rock Head just because.

I'm completely stunned so many people want to give this thing auto sunny day. I'm going to strongly echo the previous sentiments: auto-weather is okay... on otherwise weak pokemon. This guy has great stats and amazing offensive STABs, and he was never conceived as an auto-weather pokemon literally until the ability poll rolled around. I don't want something as volatile as auto-weather flung around this unhesitatingly. If we want an auto-sun poke we can easily make one in the next CAP, so that we work from the start with balance in mind. I'd gladly support it.

 

[darkjjak]

Main: Battle Armor - do I need to explain? It wears armor!!!
Secondary: Rock Head - I don't think it's too overpowering since it's Physical Attack stat isn't all that high. If anything we could just not give it any attack boosting move.

 

[Mekkah]

Of course it fits woodman, IT FITS HIM TOO WELL. Personally, I wanted another stat spread, but most people wanted M&A's. I have no problem with that, but their stat spread was so damn careful and well thought out you guys are just throwing it to the wayside. All of the checks and balances that went in to convincing people that it wasn't overpowered are being hit with a sun+solar boosted FB. Safe abilities that don't screw with the checks are what I figured S&A wanted, otherwise people get their stat cake - and get to eat it too. Not that that's a bad thing, it's just that all of the work they did is being compromised.

Thank you.

 

[beej]

I'm sure this question has been asked, but ought of curiosity (and horror), is this ability affected by Heat Rock?

It's also not really appropriate to compare the move Sunny Day to this ability. Not only does it take an extra turn to set up, but you have to sacrifice a moveslot for it.

Main ability: Pressure
Secondary ability: Scrappy

I'd explain the choices, but the reasons why have been mentioned so many times throughout the thread, it would just be redundant to repeat them.

 

[sbc]

Rock head
Leaf Guard

 

[TekkenStorm]

Main Ability : Green House
Secondary Ability : Leaf Guard

Also can we change "Green House" name? it sounds a bit lame.

 

[Hazmat]

Leaf Guard is the only sun-based ability that wouldn't be too much.
Rock Head just because.

I'm completely stunned so many people want to give this thing auto sunny day. I'm going to strongly echo the previous sentiments: auto-weather is okay... on otherwise weak pokemon. This guy has great stats and amazing offensive STABs, and he was never conceived as an auto-weather pokemon literally until the ability poll rolled around. I don't want something as volatile as auto-weather flung around this unhesitatingly. If we want an auto-sun poke we can easily make one in the next CAP, so that we work from the start with balance in mind. I'd gladly support it.

1. Type
2. Abilities/Role
3/4. Stats
3/4. Moveset
...
...
X. Art
XY. Sprite

I think we should switch around the order that these steps come in. That way WE NEED to think about what it does before handling stats or movepool.

 

[Fishin]

Agreeing with the somewhat general consensus that Greenhouse is a bad idea. For reiteration:

Woodman comes in. Sun starts. Woodman takes 25% from Stealth Rock. Turn ends.

Opponent switches to a Woodman counter, Togekiss. Togekiss receives 25% damage from Stealth Rock.
Woodman uses Fire Blast on the switchin. Plenty of damage dealt.

If its not a KO, then Togekiss is dead next turn regardless. NOT a counter.

Greenhouse is NOT a balanced ability. Cool concept, but as others have said it's not for this Pokemon.

 

[Pombo]

1-Green House
2-Solar Power

Green House is cool, and solar power makes him not dependant, but powerfull in Sun ( sun teams arent used much)

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

I don't know what people think of anyone other than the TL posting tallied votes so I'll hold off from doing that now.

Well most of the rules say that only the Topic Leader can post a tallied vote count. If you already did a tally count of your own then I say keep it to yourself.


Also, since X-Act been spamming this notion that Auto-weather would be okay on something of Abomasnow's stature, here's what that damn tree's stat Rating look like.

Given this, if Gothic_Togekiss doesn't excercise sound judgement and kill Autosun now or shortly, there's no way in hell I'm supporting Stun Spore on this.

Is Greenhouse/Drought Jr. so damn scary that no one is willing to even test it out? My sound judgement on this situation is torn between taking this "uber" ability out of the running now and causing all whom voted for it to have their votes null and void, or just letting this damn ability go through and just allow it to be tested. You do realize that if it's proved broken, we can take the ability off right?

 

[Ali]

Main: Greenhouse because we need a non-uber sun-starter.
Secondary: Flash Fire because the idea of sending in a grass type into a fire move and getting a benefit from it is appealing.

 

[Hazmat]

Well most of the rules say that only the Topic Leader can post a tallied vote count. If you already did a tally count of your own then I say keep it to yourself.


Also, since X-Act been spamming this notion that Auto-weather would be okay on something of Abomasnow's stature, here's what that damn tree's stat Rating look like.

Is Greenhouse/Drought Jr. so damn scary that no one is willing to even test it out? My sound judgement on this situation is torn between taking this "uber" ability out of the running now and causing all whom voted for it to have their votes null and void, or just letting this damn ability go through and just allow it to be tested. You do realize that if it's proved broken, we can take the ability off right?

First of all, Abomasnow's typing is very... bad for tanking. Ours is amazing.
Second, there is no problem putting an auto-sun pokemon in the metagame for testing, but this guy is too strong for it. Everyone is saying that we should put it on a pokemon made for sunny day starting, not that it's a bad idea.

"Of course it fits woodman, IT FITS HIM TOO WELL. Personally, I wanted another stat spread, but most people wanted M&A's. I have no problem with that, but their stat spread was so damn careful and well thought out you guys are just throwing it to the wayside. All of the checks and balances that went in to convincing people that it wasn't overpowered are being hit with a sun+solar boosted FB. Safe abilities that don't screw with the checks are what I figured S&A wanted, otherwise people get their stat cake - and get to eat it too. Not that that's a bad thing, it's just that all of the work they did is being compromised."

 

[DougJustDoug]

Everyone keeps mentioning the unearthly devastation of this pokemon's Fire Blast in the sun. Did I miss the movepool vote? When did it get Fire Blast? Oh, wait a minute... I forgot that, like everything else on this pokemon, people have jumped a few polls ahead and just assumed their outcome.

I realize this is unbelievable to propose, but perhaps we might not give it moves that are overpowered? Overpowered in terms of what has already been voted. Like ability.

If the ability makes certain moves overpowered, then don't give it the moves. It's that simple. I don't give a damn what the art looks like. If this pokemon gets an ability that will allow it to OHKO every pokemon in the game, why on earth would we give it that move? Because it has artwork that "looks like it should have it"? No way. Art is nice and all, but it doesn't justify giving it broken moves.

Is it because every Fire type in the game gets Fire Blast? I admit, that's awfully compelling. But, there is no rule book that I have read that says we are obligated to do this. We can do whatever the heck we want. Personally, I think Fire Blast is a broken move to begin with. It should have 70% accuracy like every other 120 BP move. If this thing gets autosun I will argue loud and long that Fire Blast should be removed from it's TM list. Hell, maybe take off Flamethrower too.

If we really want it to have a fire move to justify those arm cannons -- let's give it Blast Burn. All the little kids LOVE that move. Make this pokemon's best Fire moves be physical, and let it use that whopping 70 ATK to deliver it. Even with autosun and bulky stats, this does not have to be broken. There are lots of pokemon with great stats and a great ability that are balanced by their movepool.

Arcanine says hi.

(Flareon would say hi, but it's giving me the finger instead)

 

[Hazmat]

Everyone keeps mentioning the unearthly devastation of this pokemon's Fire Blast in the sun. Did I miss the movepool vote? When did it get Fire Blast? Oh, wait a minute... I forgot that, like everything else on this pokemon, people have jumped a few polls ahead and just assumed their outcome.

I realize this is unbelievable to propose, but perhaps we might not give it moves that are overpowered? Overpowered in terms of what has already been voted. Like ability.

If the ability makes certain moves overpowered, then don't give it the moves. It's that simple. I don't give a damn what the art looks like. If this pokemon gets an ability that will allow it to OHKO every pokemon in the game, why on earth would we give it that move? Because it has artwork that "looks like it should have it"? No way. Art is nice and all, but it doesn't justify giving it broken moves.

Is it because every Fire type in the game gets Fire Blast? I admit, that's awfully compelling. But, there is no rule book that I have read that says we are obligated to do this. We can do whatever the heck we want. Personally, I think Fire Blast is a broken move to begin with. It should have 70% accuracy like every other 120 BP move. If this thing gets autosun I will argue loud and long that Fire Blast should be removed from it's TM list. Hell, maybe take off Flamethrower too.

If we really want it to have a fire move to justify those arm cannons -- let's give it Blast Burn. All the little kids LOVE that move. Make this pokemon's best Fire moves be physical, and let it use that whopping 70 ATK to deliver it. Even with autosun and bulky stats, this does not have to be broken. There are lots of pokemon with great stats and a great ability that are balanced by their movepool.

Arcanine says hi.

(Flareon would say hi, but it's giving me the finger instead)

Excellent point.

This is why I'm advocating art after stats/move/abilities (hurr hurr hindsight). It will be a damn travestly to not give this thing a powerful, worthwhile stab, seeing as how he has cannons for arms -- but ya' know what? It has to be done.

If this thing wins greenhouse...
Just about nobody will use it's other trait (short of scrappy, but I don't think that is exactly skyrocketing the votes).
Movepool will have to be "nerfed" from strong stabs.
This thing will still do A-snows job better than it (this is arguable though).

Gotta nerf something, I suppose. Movepool does make the most sense. Would this thing be a sun-starting pseudo-cress then?

 

[Dane]

Arcanine says hi.

(Flareon would say hi, but it's giving me the finger instead)

I lol'ed.

(Does Flareon even have fingers?)

 

[yoshi!]

Battle Armour seems to fit it well. It's got wood aromour on it.
Intimidate seems to fit it, too. What is this thing's height?

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

First of all, Abomasnow's typing is very... bad for tanking. Ours is amazing.

I'm aware of Abomasnow shit-tastic typing but I was more doing it's rating because of this:

I want Greenhouse on an Abomasnow-ish stats Pokemon.

Second, there is no problem putting an auto-sun pokemon in the metagame for testing, but this guy is too strong for it.

Maybe he is and maybe he not. We won't know until we try.

Everyone is saying that we should put it on a pokemon made for sunny day starting, not that it's a bad idea.

That's not the vibe I'm getting but I maybe interpreting all the complains as something else.

 

[Stall]

[vote removed due to the removal of Green House]

 

[TekkenStorm]

I just don't get why Woodman would be "Broken" if he had Green House as Ability, he would still be counter'd easily by a Tyranitar and it would nulify his Sunny day too with Sand Stream.

And Doug removing Fire Blast or Flamethrower from this pokemon is just too much not just every single fire pokemon gets it but even most of the other pokemon too.

Also deos Synthesis heal more in Sunny Day?