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The UU Viablity Rankings topic.
- Thread starter PK Gaming
- Start date
I'm not sure if I can agree with placing Raikou below Froslass and Moltres on the basis that it isn't a potential suspect. I mean I personally don't think it is broken or even close to, and agree that it is less suspect worthy than the aforementioned two, but many disagree, as demonstrated by the fact that it has been nominated every single round. Even Moltres and Froslass can't boast that, and the so-called special circumstances apply just as much to Froslass as they do to Raikou right now, although there is still some ambiguity with regards to what is actually meant by this.
Long story short, Raikou is still a potential suspect, so you can't really use that to distinguish them.
The people nominating it aren't voting, though, so if we make the fairly unsafe assumption that the voters are what is determining potential power, even though that was Moltres' first time being voted on, it still had a higher percentage of BL votes than Raikou. I probably would have voted BL on it myself (which would have flipped the vote to a BL) if I could have done so in good faith, since Moltres was far from dominant last period. Raikou was UU 6-4 and then 6-3, he wasn't all that close either time. There are lots of Pokemon who get nominated every round who aren't broken or particularly likely to get voted out, Raikou just happens to have to deal with the triviality of a vote repeatedly.
I wouldn't care if he was added to that tier, but I think you'd be fooling yourself if you didn't think it was dramatically more likely he'd still be standing here at the end of this tier than the other two Pokemon at that level, both of whom will probably go if they get voted on.
I wouldn't care if he was added to that tier, but I think you'd be fooling yourself if you didn't think it was dramatically more likely he'd still be standing here at the end of this tier than the other two Pokemon at that level, both of whom will probably go if they get voted on.
I have no idea what you mean by this. You think Moltres is BL, you think Raikou is BL, you think Raikou isn't very powerful, or you think Raikou has been voted on too many times, you think Moltres is powerful but not BL, or you think Moltres hasn't been voted on enough. I have no clue which of those, if any, are right.
His points were that;
-voting is more important that nominating (this was in reply to a point Lemmi made)
-on the voting, in the past Moltres has proved to be far closer to BL
-Furthermore, in the future Raikou isnt likely to get voted to be BL. Moltres, on the other hand, could already be BL (this is where he mentionned his wavering vote for Moltres)
-all this adds to Moltres being in a different category to raikou.
his post wasnt really about who he thinks is and isnt BL or who is or isnt more powerful. it was about the votes the recieved as a measure of how near BL they are.
If we have the other rain sweepers, you should probably slap Omastar on there at A rank - it's nearly identical to Gorebyss outside of the typing and a couple minor movepool differences.
I'd agree with everything flashbolt just mentioned, for what its worth (though I have no idea on Nidoqueen since I've never really used it myself).
I'd agree with everything flashbolt just mentioned, for what its worth (though I have no idea on Nidoqueen since I've never really used it myself).
Changes have been made but I have a single complaint.
I've always thought of Blaziken as an invaluable pokemon, surely it's wallbreaking merits alone deserve A? It's speed it often harped on for being terrible, but it really isn't that bad. (Base 80 is actually quite good)
It's difficult bringing it in, but Blaziken can really cause some havoc on both ends of the spectrum once it's in play.
I've always thought of Blaziken as an invaluable pokemon, surely it's wallbreaking merits alone deserve A? It's speed it often harped on for being terrible, but it really isn't that bad. (Base 80 is actually quite good)
It's difficult bringing it in, but Blaziken can really cause some havoc on both ends of the spectrum once it's in play.
Well, base 80 Speed isn't bad, but it could be faster on such an offensive Pokemon. Other offensive Pokemon have higher Speeds, such as Mismagius(105), Dugtrio(120), Raikou(115). Heck, even Uxie has a base 95. That's why I usually prefer to run the Agility set, because so many common Pokemon outspeed it. I don't think it should be A, but more like high B.
I like Blaziken. It's an excellent wall-breaker, and wall-breakers don't need to be very fast when compared to the speed of the walls it is breaking. It isn't as if it's going to be sweeping. Plus, it has Vacuum Wave for those fast-but-frail Pokemon, like Swellow. I say A Rank, and this time I'm not changing my mind. You can pick apart my argument all you want, but I use Blaziken all the time and it works great.
I'd just like to say that its quite funny that most of the Pokemon I use are all within the B-C rank lol, and I don't lose much in this tier. So even though this thread might convince you to use all the S and A rank Pokemon, remember that they aren't necessarily the best!
That being said, too many defensive Pokemon are being shunned by this list. Its pretty obvious the list favors offensive Pokemon, but things like Slowking being rank D is pathetic. Slowking does what Slowbro is suppose to do better because of its split defensive stats, and yet its lower than Slowbro on the list. In fact, Slowking is a better Blaziken counter because of its typing than Milotic, and yet Milotic always gets the notion of 'best bulky water in the tier'. Should definitely be a C at minimum.
That being said, too many defensive Pokemon are being shunned by this list. Its pretty obvious the list favors offensive Pokemon, but things like Slowking being rank D is pathetic. Slowking does what Slowbro is suppose to do better because of its split defensive stats, and yet its lower than Slowbro on the list. In fact, Slowking is a better Blaziken counter because of its typing than Milotic, and yet Milotic always gets the notion of 'best bulky water in the tier'. Should definitely be a C at minimum.
Most of mine are C-E -_-. But anyway don't take the letters to seriously. B-C ranks arer good. (we have so many letters due to the sheer amount of pokemon in the tier)
And of course slapping the S tiers in one team is very foolish.
It definetely deserves to move up. I really appreciate all kinds of feedback so if you feel that any pokemon are placed too low give a shout out.
Both Slowbro/Slowking have been moved to B tier. (in my opinion hard countering Blaziken and countering Moltres warrents a mention)
Lanturn B? Think about it, does it compare to the pokemon next to it (Sceptile/Hitmontop/Feraligatr)? C rank for me. Jumpluff provides amazing support.. Encore/Sleep Powder While SubSeeding well. C rank too. Golduck - single-handedly pwns most Rain and Sun teams. Also a C. Omastar in Rain should be with Gorebyss in A
I think this is a pretty common misconception by most of the people who play this game. If it doesn't sweep people, people don't respect it. This is also probably a factor in why basically every suspect is offensive while stuff like Registeel never even gets considered. Even Cresselia was booted partially (primarily?) because of it's offensive prowess rather than its defensive ability. I'm still not completely sure what this list is supposed to be based on, but I'm not sure I believe shit like Blaziken or Absol (which is not very good at fighting many of the common Pokemon right now) or even Houndoom/Sceptile/Rotom are as valuable to a team as some of the defensive pivots in the tier below. I don't "get' how much people allow their perceptions to be tinted by sweeping power.
Definitely agreeing on Slowking (which was already moved). As much as this isn't a usage list, with as much as I've been seeing Blastoise (thanks Moltres, Froslass) it's kinda funny to see him in the C tier. Though somehow the never seen Lanturn is in B - I definitely wouldn't consider it a tier up on Blastoise/Steelix/Tangrowth/etc.
I'd like to see Dugtrio up a tier, too... he's not as simple to use as many of the Pokemon around above him on the list right now, but he's one of the most effective pokemon in the tier when used correctly.
Woah woah woah. Okay, Absol could use a drop, I've come to realize that it's not that good. But Blaziken being shit? A premier wall breaker that can actually take down many pokemon on both ends of the defensive spectrum.
I guess you raise a good point. Lanturn should drop (it's a great Moltres counter though)
You also raise a good point about offense being a tad overrated. I wouldn't drop Houndoom because a single nasty plot puts him in killing mode but I think Sceptile is dying. (I find myself having difficulty picking Sceptile over Venusaur at times and even when I pick him Venusaur can hard counter the specs set on the predicted Leaf Storm...)
I actually think it deserves C tier...
You forget that Rotom can be an excellent defensive pokemon. As a rest talker it can literally hard counter many pokemon (Registeel, pretty much all fighting types even Foresight hitmontop and more)