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The Smogon "Suspect Test" Ladder is in full effect! "mark 2"
- Thread starter Jumpman16
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i finally got to play on the suspect ladder and it is very fun. my new team is utilizing a core of shaymin/crobat/porygon2.
without chomp the new main threats (luke, sala, gyara) are pretty easily covered by that trio. im also noticing that the most common shaymin switchings are also covered well by porygon2 (heatran and salamence). crobat is as good as ever ouspeeding almost every pokemon and being able to dish out a lot with brave bird
without chomp the new main threats (luke, sala, gyara) are pretty easily covered by that trio. im also noticing that the most common shaymin switchings are also covered well by porygon2 (heatran and salamence). crobat is as good as ever ouspeeding almost every pokemon and being able to dish out a lot with brave bird
I'm thinking that my next endeavor is going to be a Scarfed Magnezone with TBolt/HP Ground. Now, I know that it sounds dumb, but 252/252 Timid Magnezone outruns Modest Heatran and traps it, outruns all Lucario and takes lol% damage from Extremespeed (and doubly so for Bullet Punch), outruns bulky or Adamant Gyarados after 1 DD and KOs with TBolt. Doesn't do much about Salamence, but Mamoswine can deal with that, especially after all the aforementioned foes are out of the way.
Has anyone also been noticeing a lot of Umbreons as well? Pretty much to set-up Lucario as usual...
And they both die to mah friend Hariyama ^_^
Ok, I've been trying my best on this ladder (though my team is really starting to succumb to some massive hax =[), but I guess I should contribute some stuff to this thread.
First off, Fire resisters such as Vaporeon, Milotic, Gyarados, Swampert and Suicune have been given massive pushes in their usage on the Suspect Test ladder. I have a feeling that this is due to the huge surge of Heatrans that are now on the ladder (including my own :D).
Without Garchomp's huge usage as a problem on this ladder, I'm really starting to see just how much Gengar is used, and if statistics do come out for this ladder, I believe that Gengar is going to be in the #1 position without a doubt. I think that the spike in usage for Gengar comes from less of a need for Choice Scarf, thanks to the lack of Deoxys-S. Also, it's not as easy to beat anymore, because now it's able to run Substitute over HP Ice, which is a big pain, since it's hard to Thunder Wave it now.
That's all I can remember for now. However, one prediction that I have is that 6-pokemon sweeper teams are going to become popular again on this ladder. Without Deoxys-S there to wreck them, they're going to start running wild, though it may not be as horrendously easy to win with them without the sweeping power of Garchomp to screw over teams.
First off, Fire resisters such as Vaporeon, Milotic, Gyarados, Swampert and Suicune have been given massive pushes in their usage on the Suspect Test ladder. I have a feeling that this is due to the huge surge of Heatrans that are now on the ladder (including my own :D).
Without Garchomp's huge usage as a problem on this ladder, I'm really starting to see just how much Gengar is used, and if statistics do come out for this ladder, I believe that Gengar is going to be in the #1 position without a doubt. I think that the spike in usage for Gengar comes from less of a need for Choice Scarf, thanks to the lack of Deoxys-S. Also, it's not as easy to beat anymore, because now it's able to run Substitute over HP Ice, which is a big pain, since it's hard to Thunder Wave it now.
That's all I can remember for now. However, one prediction that I have is that 6-pokemon sweeper teams are going to become popular again on this ladder. Without Deoxys-S there to wreck them, they're going to start running wild, though it may not be as horrendously easy to win with them without the sweeping power of Garchomp to screw over teams.
I'm getting beaten horribly using different teams/movesets by different and strange pokémon combos. I mean, I even found a Electivire+Gyarados yesterday :/
I don't know if it's a bad or good sign, but I'm liking it. So are everybody.
I don't know if it's a bad or good sign, but I'm liking it. So are everybody.
In my time on this ladder i've noticed a few things. The first is obviously the usefulness of porygon 2. I won't go into detail about that, as it's already been covered in the past discussion. I would like to know though how much porygon 2 takes from a mixmence if it's hit with brick break on the switch. Could it survive a predicted brick break+draco meteor? I'll try it, but i'd appreciate it if maybe someone a bit more technologically savvy could run some calcs.
EDIT: yeah brick break + Draco meteor kills porygon 2, that could be a new way to get rid of it with mence
The secong thing is that i'm seeing less and less blissey. It would seem that people are shying away from "pure" walls, and opting instead for bulkier pokemon that have key resistances. I know this has been going on for a while, but i've really noticed an increase of that style of play.
To me it seems that more and more teams have less of a strategy, and that people are putting more effort into creating teams with better defensive coverage in the hope that once the battle has begun they will be prepared for anything. Of course, you'll always see the occasional attempt to setup lucario or another dangerous sweeper, but i think that's becoming less popular.
EDIT: yeah brick break + Draco meteor kills porygon 2, that could be a new way to get rid of it with mence
The secong thing is that i'm seeing less and less blissey. It would seem that people are shying away from "pure" walls, and opting instead for bulkier pokemon that have key resistances. I know this has been going on for a while, but i've really noticed an increase of that style of play.
To me it seems that more and more teams have less of a strategy, and that people are putting more effort into creating teams with better defensive coverage in the hope that once the battle has begun they will be prepared for anything. Of course, you'll always see the occasional attempt to setup lucario or another dangerous sweeper, but i think that's becoming less popular.
As much as I love the new metagame in the suspect test, I'm trying to replace the Deoxys I lost, to varying degrees of sucess. This has done me pretty well:
Gengar@ Expert belt
Nature: Timid
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 Spa/ 252 Spe/ 4 Atk
Shadow ball
Hypnosis/ HP ice/ Substitute
Focus punch
Thunderbolt
Focus punch does better on this than focus blast does, for the ability to 2HKO Blissey. It works very well with both Hypnosis and Substitute.
Gengar@ Expert belt
Nature: Timid
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 252 Spa/ 252 Spe/ 4 Atk
Shadow ball
Hypnosis/ HP ice/ Substitute
Focus punch
Thunderbolt
Focus punch does better on this than focus blast does, for the ability to 2HKO Blissey. It works very well with both Hypnosis and Substitute.
Just don't get yourself caught against a Scarf Heatran.
During the periods of when I tried the Suspect Ladder...I didn't really notice any Umbreons showing up. I've ran into mainly Salamences.
Then again, I haven't battled in a few days (work) so when I get home tonight, I'm going to be battling for a long time.
But I did notice somewhere that someone mentioned that MixApe has become even deadlier. I have always used Infernape in my team and I think his threat level has risen slightly. Deoxys was a useful counter for the speedy ape, so with him gone Infernape can roam free...if you exclude Gyarados, Dugtrio, Cressilia, Starmie (and so on and so forth). I never found much of a change. I did, however, notice the increase in Heatrans. Fortunately I often find out if it's scarfed or not way before Infernape comes out. I'm glad Heatran is seeing more playtime, as I often noticed in OU that with the plethora of Garchomps Draco Meteoring and Earthquaking away...Heatran wasn't going to be out much.
When I did play on the ladder I also noticed a bit of a drop in Sandstorm teams. I don't know why...maybe it was just me. Considering that Garchomp benefited from Sandstorm, maybe that's why? But I doubt that is the case, since you still have many Pokemon that abuse it (Rhyperior and Regirock to name a few).
Just my two cents.
hmm I really haven't seen anyone else use that, it might be because I battled you twice. One thing I have noticed is the usefulness of snorlax because of the popularity of heatran, p2 and magnezone.
I've only been playing on this ladder since this morning, but I'll say that it feels a whole lot safer without the threat of Garchomp or Deoxys. Less Tyranitar, a whole lot more Salamence and Heatran, as everyone else has said too. Porygon2 is doing a whole hell of a lot better now, as he easily replaces Mesprit as my "big sweeper" counter (Salamence, Garchomp, and Gyarados mostly), simply due to Trace being that much better, as Levitate isn't needed much without Garchomp about. Porygon2 can just take on the ever rising Heatran as opposed to Garchomp.
Mamoswine has been on every team I've seen, probably due to the large rise in Salamence.
The metagame isn't too different than Standard otherwise. Azelf and Infernape leads are still way common, and Gengar still owns up teams.
Other than more pokemon suddenly becoming viable for play, the Suspect Test is my favorite metagame! I don't play enough (both time wise or play well enough) to be able to have my say on the topic of the two suspect pokemon being banned, but it is much funner to play on ST Ladder than Standard.
Mamoswine has been on every team I've seen, probably due to the large rise in Salamence.
The metagame isn't too different than Standard otherwise. Azelf and Infernape leads are still way common, and Gengar still owns up teams.
Other than more pokemon suddenly becoming viable for play, the Suspect Test is my favorite metagame! I don't play enough (both time wise or play well enough) to be able to have my say on the topic of the two suspect pokemon being banned, but it is much funner to play on ST Ladder than Standard.
I keep Vaporeon around for that.
Anyway, ScarfZone is goddamn AMAZING on the Suspect ladder. Not only is it a permanent 100% full stop to both SD Luke and Specs Luke, but it also OHKO and outspeeds Gyarados, 2HKOs Salamence (even bulky variants), and OHKOs all non-scarfed Heatran. It also takes care of the old Magnezone standbys such as Skarmory and Bronzong, though if the Bronzong is one of the few that carries EQ, it spells doom for your poor Magnezone. It also makes a phenomenal lategame sweeper, especially since unlike Heatran (its major competitor for lategame Scarf sweeping), there are very few special walls that like taking base 130 TBolts to the face.
The Speed is pretty awesome too. It beats all neutral-natured Base 130 (by one point, no less). While it loses to timid Starmie and Azelf, those are rare and have other counters. It beats all non-scarfed Gengar, Salamence, Dragonite, and a lot of other major metagame threats. Just watch out for Dugtrio and Gliscor, as there's not a lot this Poke can do to Gliscor other than boomsplode on it (which it does very well, mind you). I might change the nature from Timid to whatever +Spe -SpD is, just because this thing isn't walling special hits not named Air Slash any time soon.
While battling on the Suspect Ladder, I've noticed quite a few things popping up.
I've found that more Bulky Waters are being more often used more now (I'm guessing it's because of Heatran).
I've also seen Calm Mind Jirachi's becoming much more popular; but with Substitute. I'm guessing it's because without Garchomp present, it can sweep through teams fairly well.
I've also seen quite an abudance in Starmie. They've been popping up all around the place.; though I haven't seena ny with Rapid Spin.
I've also been seeing Choice Specs Lucario becoming much more popular. I'm not sure if it's due to Garchomp not being present, but it's much more popular now like the first days of DP.
I've also seen Skarmory's beginning to pop up more.
Oh yeah, and Porygon2 is becoming really popular now.
That's all I remember as of now.
I've found that more Bulky Waters are being more often used more now (I'm guessing it's because of Heatran).
I've also seen Calm Mind Jirachi's becoming much more popular; but with Substitute. I'm guessing it's because without Garchomp present, it can sweep through teams fairly well.
I've also seen quite an abudance in Starmie. They've been popping up all around the place.; though I haven't seena ny with Rapid Spin.
I've also been seeing Choice Specs Lucario becoming much more popular. I'm not sure if it's due to Garchomp not being present, but it's much more popular now like the first days of DP.
I've also seen Skarmory's beginning to pop up more.
Oh yeah, and Porygon2 is becoming really popular now.
That's all I remember as of now.
As everybody has mentioned, mence usage has rocketed, particually the DD set. There has also been considerably more heatran and mamoswine. I've been playing with a baton pass team and I've had a fair amount of sucess as there seems to be far less roar/whirlwind (not that it matters once I've got ingrain up)
I played two seperate matches with a similar strategy on the ladder as well, but I thought that it was a coincidence that I met two different players with Rain Dance Jirachi and Swords Dance Kabutops. The second encounter with this strategy, by the way, had a Life Orb Kabutops. You claim you've seen a ton, and well... that's a lot. It must be something, heh?
I honestly cannot see this becomming a popular trend.
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