Gen 6 ORAS Ubers EV Spread Compendium

Peli

name elevated but i still act average

Amazing art by Bummer
Approved by Sweep and Fireburn
Original thread by 2xTheTap
Ubers EV Spread Compendium

Hello everyone, and welcome to Ubers’ EV spread compendium. This thread is a resource designed to assist old and new players alike in choosing the optimal Effort Value spreads and natures for each Pokemon in Ubers.

All too often, I have seen players with a Ho-Oh that is only able to switch into Stealth Rock once, or having Xerneas not outpace A scarf Genesect. This resource sets out to inform players as to how to avoid making these sorts of mistakes when finishing EV spreads during the teambuilding process, while simultaneously providing a forum where alternative, yet viable EV spreads and natures can be discussed.

In this thread, you may suggest EV spreads and natures for Pokemon listed B- and above (standard or otherwise).If the spread and nature you are suggesting is not standard, you must provide rationale for why these non-standard spreads are viable.


However, including additional spreads to speed creep these new EV spreads is discouraged, as speed creeping has to end at some point.

Always be sure to back up your argument with damage calculations (if applicable) or the speed of the Pokemon you are attempting to check or counter.

Before re-posting standard EV spreads or creating new ones, be sure to check out these resources first:
http://www.smogon.com/smog/issue2/saving_hp2http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/magic-number-of-hp.3456308/

Both of these threads explain in which scenarios an Odd number of HP would be superior, and when an Even number would be superior.

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/a-beginners-guide-to-stat-distribution.3503580/

Here's a nice overview written by scorpdestroyer that includes EVs, IVs, natures and how to EV, generally speaking.

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/oras-ubers-speed-tiers.3530917/

And finally, this comprehensive resource on speed tiers by Minority Suspect in Ubers should be your new best friend when creating new EV spreads.

THIS THREAD IS FOR SHARING AND EXPLAINING YOUR CUSTOM EV SPREADS, IF I BELIEVE YOUR SPREAD HAS A GOOD NICHE FOR THAT POKEMON IN PARTICULAR, IT WILL BE ADDED.

S+ Rank


Stealth Rock Support Groudon

252 HP / 56 Def / 200 SpD Relaxed / Impish

The defense Evs let Groudon survive a boosted Xerneas Focus Blast after Stealth Rock. Max HP along with 56 Def allows Groudon to always live a +2 EQ from Arceus,regardless of nature. It also allows Groudon to avoid the 2HKO from Primal Kyogre's Ice Beam, Zekrom's Outrage, and Jolly Mega Salamence's Double-Edge after Stealth Rock damage. This is all under the case of Groudon taking Stealth Rock damage as normal Groudon.

Rock Polish Groudon

104 HP / 252 Atk / 96 SpD / 56 Spe Adamant

The Speed EVs allow Primal Groudon to outpace Choice Scarf base 90 Speed Pokemon and below after a Rock Polish, while the HP and Special Defense EVs allow it to survive a boosted Focus Blast from Geomancy Xerneas after Stealth Rock damage. The rest of the EVs go into Attack to hit as hard as possible.

Double Dance Groudon

248 HP / 152 Atk / 52 SpD / 56 Spe Adamant

The speed EVs stay the same as RP Primal Groudon. The HP EVs over attack EVs give Primal Groudon more breathing room to set up.

Mixed Rock Polish

96 Atk / 252 SpA / 104 SpD / 56 Spe Mild

56 Speed EVs allow Primal Groudon to outspeed Choice Scarf base 90 Speed Pokemon, while 104 Special Defense EVs ensure Primal Groudon will always survive Focus Blast from a boosted Geomancy Xerneas at full health. 96 Attack EVs to allow Primal Groudon to 2HKO Water Arceus with Precipice Blades after Stealth Rock if it lacks Defense investment. The rest of the EVs go to Special Attack to maximize the power of Fire Blast. A Mild nature increases Primal Groudon's Special Attack further while not hindering its Attack or Special Defense.

Special Defense Groudon

252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe Sassy / Careful

EVs max out special bulk and this spread could be used on teams where more security is needed to check Primal Kyogre and Xerneas, and physical attackers like Extreme Killer Arceus are checked by other members of the team.


S Rank

Extreme Killer

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly

Maximum Attack and Speed investment should be used so that Arceus-Normal can at worst Speed tie with opposing Arceus formes. Silk Scarf boosts the power of Extreme Speed without causing recoil damage.

Wall-ceus

248 HP / 204 Def / 56 Spe Bold

56 Speed allows Arceus to outpace Adamant Rayquaza, while the rest is dumped into bulk. Wall-ceus can effectively check every physical threat bar Ho-Oh.


Dragon Dance

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly / Adamant

Maximum Attack and Speed EVs with a Jolly nature give Salamence the ability to Speed tie with maximum Speed Arceus and to hit as hard as possible. However, an Adamant nature with Double-Edge bestows Salamence the ability to pose as a solid wallbreaker before using Dragon Dance.

Bulky Dragon Dance

248 HP / 136 Def / 124 Spe Impish

The above EVs and an Impish nature give Salamence as much bulk as possible while outspeeding the base 90 Speed tier An alternate of 248 HP / 48 Def / 212 Spe with an Impish nature can outspeed the base 100 Speed tier at the cost of bulk.

Defensive

248 HP / 204 Def / 16 Spe Impish

The EV spread lets Mega Salamence outspeed Adamant Rayquaza and Modest Kyurem-W. If one wishes to aim for a higher benchmark, an EV spread of 248 HP / 172 Def / 88 Spe with an Impish nature lets Salamence outspeed Modest Xerneas and Yveltal. An even higher benchmark is 248 HP / 136 Def / 124 Spe with an Impish nature, letting Salamence outspeed maximum Speed Primal Groudon and Primal Kyogre.


Geomancy

184 HP / 28 Def / 252 SpA / 44 Spe Modest

Maximum Special Attack investment ensures that Xerneas hits as hard as possible once boosted so that it can effectively sweep; the most prominent benchmark is a guaranteed OHKO on maximum HP Arceus formes after Stealth Rock. 44 Speed EVs are used so that Xerneas is faster than Choice Scarf Genesect after a Geomancy boost. 28 Defense EVs give Genesect a Special Attack boost with Download and, when combined with the 184 HP EVs, they allow Xerneas to always survive a +2 standard Extreme Killer Arceus's Extreme Speed after Stealth Rock.

Choice Scarf

32 Def / 252 SpA / 224 Spe Modest

252 Special Attack EVs with a Modest nature are used to maximize the damage output of Moonblast, better allowing Xerneas to revenge kill weakened threats and chip away at Pokemon such as Primal Groudon. 224 Speed EVs are used to outspeed +1 Rayquaza and Kyurem-W. 32 EVs are slotted to Defense to ensure that Genesect gets a Special Attack boost from Download. Running 252 Speed EVs is an option that allows Choice Scarf Xerneas to outspeed maximum Speed Deoxys-A and tie with opposing 252 Speed Choice Scarf Xerneas. If using Rock Slide, the 32 Defense EVs can be invested into Attack, which slightly increases the damage output of Rock Slide but fails to meet a specific benchmark.

All-Out-Attacker

32 Atk / 252 SpA / 224 Spe Mild/Rash

Maximum Special Attack investment is used to ensure high damage output from Moonblast and Xerneas's special coverage moves. A Mild nature is preferred to better switch into Yveltal without forfeiting physical attacking power. Alternatively, a Rash nature is an option for teams that would rather benefit from Xerneas taking physical attacks such as priority moves. 224 Speed EVs are used to outspeed Adamant Rayquaza and all slower threats. The remaining 32 EVs are slotted into Attack, which raises the damage output of Close Combat slightly and increases the probability of Xerneas being able to OHKO standard Ho-Oh with Rock Slide.

Defensive

248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD Bold

248 HP EVs are used to significantly raise defensive Xerneas's mixed bulk. 252 Defense EVs with a Bold nature are used to maximize physical bulk, which helps Xerneas tank blows in a predominantly physical metagame. The remaining 8 EVs are slotted into Special Defense.

Calm Mind

248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD Bold

248 HP EVs are used to increase overall bulk, which aids in the set up of Calm Mind and the use of Rest. 252 Defense EVs with a Bold nature are used to reduce the damage from physical attacks, especially from Aegislash and Primal Groudon. The remaining 8 EVs are placed into Special Defense.

A+ Rank

Support Arceus

248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe Jolly

Full investment in Speed is used to Speed tie with Extreme Killer Arceus and physical Ground Arceus, potentially burning them with Will-O-Wisp before they can hit Ghost Arceus with Swords Dance-boosted attacks. Maximum HP investment grants Ghost Arceus a solid amount of bulk. It is possible to drop to 176 Speed EVs to outspeed Latias and Latios, or even 96 Speed EVs for outspeeding base 100 Speed Pokemon, with the rest poured into Defense.

Calm Mind

248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe Timid

Full investment in Speed at worst allows Ghost Arceus to Speed tie Extreme Killer Arceus, Swords Dance Ground Arceus, and Mega Salamence and burn them or hit them with Judgment or Focus Blast; additionally, this lets Ghost Arceus tie with other miscellaneous maximum Speed Arceus formes. Full HP investment grants Ghost Arceus a solid amount of bulk. It is possible to drop to 176 Speed EVs for outspeeding Latias and Latios, but no lower.

Swords Dance

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly

Full investment in Attack and Speed grants Ghost Arceus significant offensive prowess and lets it, at worst, Speed tie with opposing Arceus formes. It is also feasible to run Adamant for more power, although this might allow Ghost Arceus to be burned by opposing support Arceus formes and outsped by Latias and Latios.


Life Orb Attacker

4 Def / 252 Spa / 252 Spe Timid

252 Speed EVs with a Timid nature allow Darkrai to outspeed Arceus formes and below. This is very important because one of Darkrai's greatest assets to an offensive team is its ability to pressure common Defoggers. The maximum Speed investment is also optimal for Darkrai versus Darkrai matchups, which aren't particularly common but still relevant enough to mention. 252 Special Attack EVs are invested in order to boost Darkrai's Special Attack so that Darkrai can sweep with Nasty Plot or intermediately wallbreak opposing Pokemon. The remaining 4 EVs are slotted into Defense as to not give Genesect an Attack boost with Download.


Offensive Mega Gengar
4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Timid

The EVs and nature capitalize on Mega Gengar's best stats, allowing it to outspeed the vast majority of the unboosted metagame and be as destructive as possible. Due to its highly specialized stats, alternative spreads are barely viable.
Perish Trapper

248 HP / 84 SpD / 176 Spe Timid

The Speed investment allows Mega Gengar to outspeed Arceus, as other threats it could outspeed with more investment are too threatening to handle with this set. The remaining EVs maximize Mega Gengar's special bulk, as it has no attacking moves and most attacks in the tier are specially based. 248 HP EVs give Gengar an odd HP number, allowing it to use Substitute four times.

180 SpA / 76 SpD / 252 Spe Timid

The EVs allow Gengar to live a Moonblast after a Geomancy from Xerneas


Tank

248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe Adamant

Even with Ho-Oh's gargantuan special bulk, it still needs near maximum HP investment along with 52 Special Defense EVs in order to always survive a +2 Thunder from Geomancy Xerneas. Earthquake Ho-Oh runs 12 Speed EVs minimum in order to stay in and Earthquake Diancie before it Mega Evolves. The remaining EVs are used in Attack in order to put as much power behind Brave Bird and Sacred Fire as possible. If Ho-Oh's team already has a very good backbone that checks Geomancy Xerneas, running maximum Attack investment is an option also.

Choice Band

248 HP / 196 Atk / 52 SpD / 12 Spe Adamant

Even with Ho-Oh's gargantuan special bulk, it still needs near maximum HP investment along with 52 Special Defense EVs in order to always survive a +2 Thunder from Geomancy Xerneas. Earthquake Ho-Oh runs 12 Speed EVs minimum in order to stay in and Earthquake Diancie before it Mega Evolves. The remaining EVs are used in Attack in order to put as much power behind Brave Bird and Sacred Fire as possible. If Ho-Oh's team already has a very good backbone that checks Geomancy Xerneas, running maximum Attack and Speed investment with an Adamant or Jolly nature works also in order to limit Kyogre and other base 90s.


CM + 3 Attacks

172 HP / 252 SpA / 84 Spe Modest

84 Speed EVs allow Primal Kyogre to outspeed anything slower than minimum Speed base 100 Pokemon, such as Jirachi, defensive Xerneas and Yveltal, and most Primal Groudon. Special Attack is maximized to deal as much damage as possible, and the rest of the EVs goes to HP to bolster Primal Kyogre's solid bulk. Fully investing in Speed is also an option, but doing so won't confer many benefits outside of outspeeding faster Primal Groudon variants.

Defensive

248 HP / 248 Def / 12 Spe Bold

12 Speed EVs allow Primal Kyogre to outspeed Diancie on the turn it Mega Evolves, KOing it with Scald before it can retaliate with Diamond Storm. The leftover EVs go into HP and Defense to maximize Primal Kyogre's physical bulk, though it is still quite specially bulky. Attacks it is capable of surviving at full health include a Dragon Dance-boosted Double-Edge from Jolly Mega Salamence, a Nasty Plot-boosted Dark Pulse from Life Orb Darkrai, and a Swords Dance Life Orb-boosted Extreme Speed from Normal Arceus.

One can also invest in Primal Kyogre's Special Defense rather than Defense. At the expense of becoming vulnerable to physical attackers, this makes Primal Kyogre an excellent check to key special attackers such as Darkrai, Calm Mind Arceus formes, and Geomancy Xerneas assuming you have Roar to phaze it.


Defensive

248 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe Bold / Impish

Running maximum Defense investment allows Yveltal to take strong physical attacks. The HP investment nearly maximizes Yveltal's ability to take physical hits while minimizing the amount of damage it takes from Stealth Rock. A Bold nature is preferred when using Toxic; if Yveltal has Sucker Punch on its set, use an Impish nature to maximize Sucker Punch's damage with no Attack investment. Dread Plate can be used to boost the power of Foul Play and Sucker Punch if it's necessary; it notably allows Foul Play to OHKO +2 Attack Extreme Killer Arceus without help from Stealth Rock or Life Orb damage. Use a Bold nature when using Heat Wave.

Life orb
132 HP / 28 Atk / 252 SpA / 96 Spe

Maximum Special Attack investment allows Yveltal's Dark Pulse and Oblivion Wing to hit as hard as possible. 92 Speed EVs allow Yveltal to outrun Lugia that have no Speed invested and are more than enough to outrun standard Geomancy Xerneas. 132 HP EVs give Yveltal respectable bulk and the ability to survive Mega Salamence's Return only after Stealth Rock damage. The rest of the EVs are put into Attack to power up Sucker Punch. A Rash nature is used instead of Mild in order to make Yveltal take less damage from Extreme Speed and Primal Groudon's Stone Edge or Fire Punch. A Mild nature can be used if Mewtwo is the bigger concern, though. Black Glasses should be used with U-turn so that Yveltal takes less chip damage when switching in, though without Life Orb, Oblivion Wing's power is significantly reduced versus Primal Groudon and Xerneas.

Choice Scarf
32 HP / 4 Def / 248 SpA / 224 Spe Modest

32 HP and 4 Defense EVs allow Yveltal to always survive a +2 Extreme Speed from standard Extreme Killer Arceus in order to KO it with Foul Play after recoil from its own Life Orb. This also leaves Yveltal with an odd HP number, which allows it to switch into Stealth Rock four times instead three. The Speed EVs conveniently allow Yveltal to outspeed the rare but extremely dangerous +1 Adamant Dragon Dance Rayquaza and Modest Choice Scarf Kyurem-W. 248 Special Attack EVs power up Dark Pulse and Oblivion Wing. A Modest nature must be used, as otherwise Dark Pulse misses out on quite a few key KOs, such as a 2HKO on offensive Primal Groudon.

A Rank

Swords Dance

252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe Timid

Full investment in Attack and Speed allows Arceus-Ground to outpace most of the tier, letting it Speed tie with other max Speed Arceus formes, and allows its moves to hit for maximum damage, with four special defense EVs giving Genesect an Attack boost so it cannot attack with a boosted Ice Beam. As Arceus-Ground has an excellent typing and bulk, HP investment is unnecessary most of the time. Another interesting spread is Adamant with full Speed, Attack, and four Special Defense. This allows Arceus-Ground to hit much harder and still reaches 339 Speed, allowing it to Speed tie with max Speed base 105s, which admittedly are rare, and also outpace Palkia and everything below it. Most importantly of all, it allows it to outpace support Arceus formes that run standard 96+ Speed spreads. It also outruns Arceus formes around this range that Speed creep each other and gives Arceus-Ground a chance to OHKO those neutral to Earthquake at +2 after Stealth Rock. Thus, Arceus-Ground can escape a burn, whereas Jolly Arceus cannot OHKO after Stealth Rock at all. However, this does mean that non-Mega Gengar can outspeed and Destiny Bond Arceus away, which it cannot do against Jolly variants. If using Arceus-Ground on a Sticky Web team, an alternative spread with Adamant nature, 40 HP, 252 Attack, 4 Special Defense and 212 Speed can be used. 212 Speed allows it to outspeed base 100s such as Mega Charizard Y, which is immune to Sticky Web and hits hard with Fire Blast or Solar Beam. However, tailoring EV Spreads to suit your team is perfectly fine; investing in HP and Defense is perfectly reasonable if you prefer to be able to take on Zekrom better, as well as having better all around bulk. An important benchmark to hit is running enough Speed to beat Palkia. An example of such a spread is 80 Attack and 112 Speed with a Jolly nature, which allows Arceus-Ground to outspeed Garchomp and OHKO Palkia, Mewtwo, and Mega Mewtwo Y from full health at +2;the rest can then be invested in bulk to comfortably take attacks from things such as Zekrom.


Support

248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 SpD Careful

248 HP EVs maximize mixed bulk while maintaining an odd HP value to ensure that Klefki takes less damage from entry hazards and status. 252 Special Defense EVs and a Careful nature best take on special attackers, such as Xerneas, Yveltal, and various Arceus formes. 8 Attack EVs provide a minimal amount of additional power, though it can have a slight effect against certain bulky Substitute Geomancy Xerneas sets.


Support

212 HP / 120 SpA / 176 Spe Timid / Modest

176 Speed EVs and a Timid nature are used to ensure that Latias is faster than Pokemon with base 100 Speed, such as Palkia and Mega Kangaskhan. 120 Special Attack EVs allow Latias to 2HKO offensive Primal Kyogre with Psyshock and 2HKOes Primal Groudon that lack significant Special Defense investment. All other investment for this set goes into HP, allowing Latias to escape the 2HKO from Primal Kyogre's Ice Beam. An alternate spread of 160 HP / 52 Def / 120 SpA / 176 Spe still checks Kyogre but gives up some special bulk to better tank Dragon Claw from Adamant Primal Groudon. 96 Speed EVs and a Timid nature will beat Pokemon with base 90 Speed, while 136 Speed EVs and a Timid nature will beat max Speed Rayquaza. Lastly, max Speed is an option to Speed tie with opposing Latias, Latios, Gengar before Mega Evolution, and Mega Diancie.

Calm Mind

80 HP / 252 SpA / 176 Spd Timid

176 Speed EVs and a Timid nature are used to meet the benchmark of outspeeding base 100 Speed Pokemon. High Special Attack investment is used to help Latias blast through threats and capitalize on Soul Dew + Calm Mind boosts. All other EVs go into HP to help Latias take hits. Max Speed is an option to Speed tie with other base 110 Speed Pokemon.

All-Out Attacker

76 HP / 252 SpA / 180 Spe Timid

180 Speed EVs and a Timid nature allow Latias to outspeed max Speed base 100s accounting for the IV drop from using Hidden Power Fire. This is an offensive set, 252 Special Attack EVs are used to maximize damage output. The additional EVs go into HP to help Latias take priority and attacks in general better. Max Speed is an option to Speed tie with other max Speed base 110s, but because Hidden Power requires an IV drop in Speed, only use max Speed with Roost.


Offensive Defog

4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Timid / Modest

Max Special Attack and Speed investment is standard on special attackers and lets Latios hit as hard and fast as possible. A Modest nature with enough Speed to outrun base 90s can be used for the power boost but is generally inferior to Timid. 176 Speed EVs with a Timid nature can be used to give Latios a little more bulk, but again, if bulk is what is desired, Latias should be carefully considered.

CM + Draco Meteor

4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Timid

Max Special Attack and Speed investment is straightforward. Latios should always use its dual STAB moves for strong attacks. Calm Mind lets Latios boost, while Roost allows Latios to regain its health.


Physically Defensive

252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD Bold

252 HP EVs give Lugia maximum mixed bulk while also giving Lugia an HP value that is divisible by 16, which increases Leftovers recovery. 252 Defense EVs with a Bold nature help Lugia consistently take hits from the physical attackers in Ubers. Alternate Speed benchmarks include moving 96 Defense EVs to Speed to outspeed neutral-natured, fully invested base 90 Speed, while 136 Speed EVs allow Lugia to outspeed 252 Speed Adamant Rayquaza. Multiscale halves the damage that Lugia takes while at full HP, which lets Lugia take boosted hits from strong attackers relatively well.


Special Attacker

4 Def / 252 Spa / 252 Spe Timid

Maximum Speed investment with a Timid nature is used to take advantage of Mewtwo's great Speed tier. 252 Special Attack EVs maximize Mewtwo's offensive capabilities, allowing it to most efficiently fulfill its role as a fast, strong special attacker. Investing 4 Defense EVs gives Mewtwo a minimal buffer against physical attacks, though this is mostly insignificant and can also go in Special Defense. It is worth noting that investing in Special Defense on the Life Orb set will give Genesect an Attack boost, which may not be desired. Which Mewtwo to run is based on team.

A- Rank

Bird Antidote

248 HP / 8 Spa / 252 Spe Timid

252 Speed EVs with a Timid nature allow Rock Arceus to outspeed a large chunk of the Ubers tier and Speed tie with other maximum Speed Arceus and Mega Salamence. 248 HP EVs help Rock Arceus stomach powerful attacks from the Pokemon it intends to check, such as avoiding the OHKO from +1 Mega Salamence's Earthquake. The remaining 8 EVs go into Special Attack to guarantee the OHKO on standard Dragon Dance Mega Salamence. An alternate spread of 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe with a Timid nature gives up some Speed to be more physically bulky, while still beating maximum base 100 Speed Pokemon.

Calm Mind

248 HP / 8 Spa / 252 Spe Timid

252 Speed EVs with a Timid nature allow Rock Arceus to beat relevant Pokemon with base 110 Speed and tie with opposing maximum Speed Arceus and Mega Salamence. 248 HP EVs are used to increase Rock Arceus's overall bulk, making it easier to set up Calm Mind and tank special attacks once set up. The remaining 8 EVs are used to slightly boost Special Attack.


Support

252 HP / 200 Def / 56 Spe Bold

252 HP EVs maximize mixed bulk, and 56 Speed EVs allow Water Arceus to outpace Adamant Rayquaza. The rest of the investment is put into Defense, with a Bold nature to help against the strong physical attackers that dominate the Ubers metagame such as Ho-Oh, Primal Groudon, and Salamence. Other usable Speed benchmarks include 124 Speed with a Bold nature for outspeeding positive-natured max Speed base 90s, and 176 Speed with a Timid Nature for outspeeding positive-natured max Speed base 110s, such as Gengar and some Latios.


All-Out Attacker

68 Atk / 252 SpA / 188 Spe Naive / Rash

The choice of nature is up to the user: a Naive nature makes Deoxys-A faster and able to outspeed more Choice Scarf users, while Rash can be used instead to give it an edge in power. It is also recommended to use Naive over Hasty and Rash over Mild as to enable Deoxys to survive more than one Rapid Spin, and there aren't any special attacks that don't outright OHKO it anyway.

In terms of EVs, the recommended spread is 68 Atk / 252 SpA / 188 Spe to make Deoxys-A able to outspeed everything up to and including Choice Scarf Xerneas with a neutral nature, while simultaneously providing Psycho Boost as much of a damage output as it is capable of achieving, and giving an extra edge to Deoxys-A's physical moves. An alternate spread for a Naive nature is maximized Special Attack and Speed, with the last four EVs dumped into Attack; this spread can be used to get a Speed tie with opposing Deoxys-A running maximal Speed investment, but other than that it doesn't have much practical use.

Suicide Lead

4 Atk / 252 SpA / 255 Spe Naive

The lead set requires as much Speed as possible, even to the point of creating a Speed tie with opposing Deoxys-A if necessary, so a Naive nature and 252 Speed EVs are optimal. The rest of the EVs are put into Special Attack to increase the damage output from Psycho Boost.


Entry Hazard Lead

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly / Timid

Focus Sash helps Deoxys-S set up an extra layer of entry hazards, as its bulk is subpar. The given EVs maximize Deoxys-S's Speed in order to ensure it can set up entry hazards quickly. If you are running Knock Off, then maximize its Attack investment and use a Jolly nature. Otherwise, use a Timid nature and a bulky EV spread of 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe.

Dual Screens

252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly

The given EVs and a Timid nature maximize Deoxys-S's bulk and Speed in order to ensure it can set up screens quickly and often. Light Clay is to prolong the duration of Reflect and Light Screen.


Support

244 HP / 252 SpD / 12 Spe Calm

244 HP EVs and maximum Special Defense with a Calm nature allow Dialga to take on the numerous special attackers of the tier, such as Mewtwo, Kyogre, and Palkia. The 12 Speed EVs are used to let Dialga outspeed maximum Speed Diancie before it Mega Evolves. A physically defensive spread could also be used instead to check Pokemon such as Rayquaza, Zekrom, and Mega Salamence better.

Offensive

244 HP / 252 SpA / 12 Spe Modest

The HP EVs give Dialga maximum bulk, while maximum Special Attack and a Modest nature give Dialga excellent power behind its attacks. 12 Speed EVs allow Dialga to outspeed Diancie before Mega Evolution.

Efficient Shuca Dialga

232 HP / 72 SpA / 180 SpD / 24 Spe Modest

Lives +2 Groundceus Earthquake after Stealth Rock with 232 HP and Shuca Berry (+2 252 Atk Earth Plate Arceus-Ground Earthquake vs. 232 HP / 0 Def Shuca Berry Dialga: 316-373 (79.1 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock). You can then Roar it out safely for something to deal w/ it later, or Metal Burst it for the clean KO. Hell, you can even set SR on it turn 1 if you wanna. This spread also lives 2 Modest Primal Kyogre Origin Pulses after Stealth Rock (252+ SpA Primal Kyogre Origin Pulse vs. 248 HP / 180 SpD Dialga in Heavy Rain: 159-187 (39.4 - 46.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock). SAtk does nothing notable I think (someone else can run calcs for this if they really wanna) but it does power up Dialga's attacks to a nice level. A few excess EVs were put in speed to be faster than Primal Groudon or something


Dance Dance Rayvolution aka Swords Dance Rayquaza

252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe Jolly / Adamant

Max Attack and Speed EVs are imperative for Rayquaza's wallbreaking efficiency, and an Adamant nature maximizes Rayquaza's power output with Swords Dance and/or Dragon Dance. However, a Jolly nature is an acceptable alternative to Adamant in order to outspeed positive-natured base 90 Speed Pokemon. The 4 EVs in Special Defense give Genesect an Attack boost from Download, giving it an incentive to use U-turn instead of Ice Beam, lowering the risk of Rayquaza being revenge killed.

MixQuaza

252 Atk / 40 Spa / 216 Spe Naive

The above EV spread provides the ability to outspeed positive-natured base 90 Speed Pokemon, including both Groudon and Kyogre, while donating some power to Special Attack to boost Draco Meteor. However, the Special Attack and Attack EVs can be flipped to do more damage with Draco Meteor to snipe bulky Primal Groudon and support Arceus formes at the cost of decreasing Dragon Ascent's power. A Naughty or Rash nature can also be utilized for extra power, as Rayquaza gets outsped by support Arceus formes anyway while being naturally faster than other walls it can break.

Choice Band Rayquaza

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Adamant

An Adamant nature maximizes Choice Band's power and makes Dragon Ascent hit as hard as it can get unboosted. A Jolly nature can also be an option to outspeed positive-natured base 90 Speed Pokemon, and Speed tie with maximum Speed Kyurem-W. Maximum Attack and Speed EVs assist all of the aforementioned attributes, letting Rayquaza be as powerful and as fast as possible.

Utility

248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD Impish/Bold

An EV spread of 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD with an Impish nature maximizes Mega Sableye's physical bulk, as it is almost always used to check physical attackers, while minimizing residual damage from hazards should it fail to keep them off the field. If using a move other than Fake Out in the fourth slot, a Bold nature should be used to minimize Foul Play damage from opposing Yveltal because Sableye's own Foul Play does not take its Attack stat into consideration. An alternative EV spread of 248 HP / 124 Def / 136 SpD with an Impish or Bold nature allows Mega Sableye to avoid the 2HKO from Timid Mega Mewtwo Y's Fire Blast and almost always avoid the 2HKO from Naive Life Orb Deoxys-A's Ice Beam, but it takes away from Mega Sableye's much-needed physical bulk and makes it more difficult for Sableye to perform its main roles of keeping hazards off the field and checking strong physical attackers at the same time. This spread avoids the 2HKO from these moves only if Stealth Rock and Spikes are off the field, so secondary hazard control such as Defog is necessary when using this EV spread.

Support248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD Careful

The spread of 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD maximizes Tyranitar's ability to take special attacks from Yveltal, Latios, Latias, and Mewtwo.

B+ Rank

Calm Mind

252 HP / 80 Def / 176 Spe Timid

Maximum HP investment maximizes Dark Arceus's mixed bulk, which allows it to set up more easily. Running 176 Speed EVs with a Timid nature allows it to outspeed positive-natured base 110 Speed Pokemon, such as Latias, Latios, and non-Mega Gengar, and KO them with Judgment before they can attack; Gengar in particular threatens Dark Arceus with Destiny Bond. Other viable Speed investment options include 96 Speed EVs with a Timid nature for outspeeding base 100 Speed Pokemon such as Palkia, non-Mega Salamence, and Kangaskhan, while 252 Speed EVs with a Timid nature allows Dark Arceus to Speed tie with at worst other Arceus formes. The remaining EVs go into physical bulk because Ubers is mostly dominated by numerous physical threats.
(no fairy box sprite rip)
Support

252 HP / 144 Def / 112 Spe Timid

Maximum HP EVs allow Fairy Arceus to switch in on many moderately powerful neutral hits, such as Hydro Pump from Palkia in neutral weather. 112 Speed EVs with a Timid nature are used to outspeed everything up to Jolly Garchomp; most significantly, this allows Fairy Arceus to outspeed and KO Timid Palkia with Judgment as well as check Mega Kangaskhan with Will-O-Wisp. The remaining 144 EVs are invested in Defense For Fairy Arceus to better stomach physical hits such as Mewtwo's Psystrike; they also come in handy in the event of a Will-O-Wisp miss against Pokemon such as Life Orb Groudon and Mega Kangaskhan. Alternatively, the 144 EVs can be invested in Special Defense for some added insurance against Palkia and Xerneas; boosted Geomancy Xerneas's Moonblast only has a 31% chance to OHKO Fairy Arceus after Stealth Rock damage. This spread can also better insure Fairy Arceus against +1 / +1 Calm Mind Arceus formes in a pinch; a +1 4 SpA Judgment from a type-neutral Arceus forme has a 8.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock damage, as opposed to a guaranteed 2HKO if the 144 SpD EVs are not run. Note that with this spread, Roar should be used as Fairy Arceus's other moves are ineffectual against the Pokemon it is supposed to check.

Calm Mind

252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe Timid

Maximum HP EVs make good use of Fairy Arceus's typing and natural bulk, while maximum Speed EVs allow it to outrun everything below its Speed tier and Speed tie any Arceus at worst. Alternatively, run the same spread as support Fairy Arceus (252 HP / 144 Def / 112 Spe), as both sets share a niche in checking the same threats. If you so wish, investing 96 EVs in SpA allows Fairy Arceus to OHKO 248 HP Ho-Oh after Stealth Rock damage. 88 SpA EVs allow Fairy Arceus to OHKO 0 HP Mega Gengar with +1 Psyshock, and 196 SpA EVs allow it to KO the 248 HP Perish Trapper variant after Stealth Rock damage. The required EVs can be siphoned from HP or Speed; just note that Fairy Arceus should retain enough Speed to outrun Timid Palkia and Jolly Mega Kangaskhan.

Offensive

80 Atk / 252 SpA / 176 Spe Timid / Naive

The Mega Evolution turn is very important, especially when Diancie is not using Protect. Diancie has more bulk when not Mega Evolved, so when it needs to survive a certain attack, sometimes the right choice is to not Mega Evolve. When using Protect, the danger of giving your opponent a free setup turn is present, although you don't have to worry about entry hazard stacking. Mega Evolving early is important for a Magic Bounce user, as Mega Diancie will want to be sent in to Magic Bounce certain attacks. Because the intended targets of Earth Power and Hidden Power Fire can punish Mega Diancie hard, you'll often have to rely on predictions to hit them as they come in. Although Mega Diancie isn't a glass cannon, it's far from indestructible; because it lacks recovery, instant or passive, there are only so many times this set can switch into even resisted attacks. Even though Mega Diancie has Magic Bounce, it doesn't necessarily lead well against all common leads; Primal Groudon and Dialga can be very dangerous due to their powerful type advantages, as can Deoxys-A with Psycho Boost.

Mega Utility

248 HP / 124 Def / 136 Spe Bold / Impish

248 HP EVs are used to make this set more bulky, but Mega Diancie is still hampered to an extent because of its low base HP along with its lack of instant recovery. 136 Speed EVs are just enough to outspeed Adamant Rayquaza. 124 Defense EVs with a Defense-boosting nature allow Mega Diancie to avoid the 2HKO from Choice Band Ho-Oh Brave Bird, survive Earthquake from max Attack Rayquaza, survive +1 Mega Salamence Earthquake, and tank other physical attacks. A Bold nature is used because the Attack drop does not significantly impact any targets of Diamond Storm. Impish is the better option if Diancie is not using Moonblast, as it will only have a physical move. Alternatively, a spread of 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe with a Bold nature beats base 90 Speed Pokemon and gains a bit of physical bulk. Max Defense is also an option to guarantee that Mega Diancie is 3HKOed by Choice Band Ho-Oh Brave Bird after Stealth Rock and survives +1 Mega Salamence Earthquake after Stealth Rock; the loss of Speed isn't that great of an issue, as Diancie loses to common base 90 Speed Pokemon anyway.


Sand Rush Driller

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Adamant / Jolly

An Adamant nature is the overall best choice, as Excadrill's Speed is more than good enough in sand and it has more power, but a Jolly nature is very useful for overall performance in and out of sand with faster Rapid Spins, in addition to outspeeding standard Xerneas and Modest Kyogre.

Support

252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD Sassy / Careful

252 HP and Special Defense EVs allow Ferrothorn to better check special attackers, such as Kyogre, while a Sassy nature further boosts Ferrothorn's special bulk. 0 Speed IVs should be used with Gyro Ball to strengthen it. Investing in Defense is also not a bad idea, as it helps Ferrothorn check powerful physical attackers such as Swords Dance Arceus variants with more ease.

Physical Defog

248 Atk / 248 Def / 12 Spe Adamant

248 Defense EVs allow Giratina-O to evade the KO from a +2 Adamant Extreme Killer Arceus's Shadow Claw after Stealth Rock damage. 12 Speed EVs let Giratina-O outpace maximum Speed Diancie before it Mega Evolves. The remaining EVs are placed into Attack and give Giratina-O the ability to hit harder in general; for example, with the EVs, Giratina-O has a stronger Shadow Sneak for picking off weakened foes, deals more chip damage with Dragon Tail, and hits Xerneas harder with Shadow Force. However, an alternative spread of 148 HP / 100 Atk / 248 Def / 12 Spe, which invests enough Attack to 2HKO Mewtwo with Shadow Sneak, can be used with Earthquake; otherwise, if running Shadow Force, maximum Attack investment is important to hit Xerneas harder.

Physical Attacker

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly

252 Speed EVs with a Jolly nature and 252 Attack EVs are run in order to take advantage of Mega Mewtwo X's its sky-high 190 Attack stat and great Speed tier. 4 Defense EVs give Mewtwo an insignificant increase to physical bulk. However, if Ice Beam is run, these 4 EVs should be moved to Special Attack and a Naive nature should be run. The item choice of Mewtwonite X is self-explanatory and necessary to access Mega Mewtwo X's typing and stats, which greatly differ from those of the base forme. An alternate spread of 180 HP / 76 Atk / 252 Spe can be used to allow Mega Mewtwo X to check Extreme Killer Arceus by surviving a +2 LO Extreme Speed and retaliating back with a Low Kick. The ability Steadfast, which Mewtwo gains upon Mega Evolution, does have a small niche in giving Mewtwo a Speed boost when Choice Scarf variants of both Genesect and Shaymin-S cause it to flinch, after which it avoids further flinches from these Pokemon.

Physically Defensive

252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD Bold

Maximum EV investment in HP and Defense allows Skarmory to better take on the physical attackers it needs to stop. Running a physically defensive spread enables Skarmory to primarily check strong physical attackers, such as Swords Dance Arceus, Mega Salamence, and some Primal Groudon, by means of phazing and Toxic stall, as well as to set up Spikes against these Pokemon and punish switches accordingly.

Specially Defensive

252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD Calm

252 HP and 252 Special Defense EVs with a Calm nature are necessary to best take on Latias, Latios, and Arceus, as Skarmory's base Special Defense stat is low. The main niche of the specially defensive Skarmory set is that it functions as a Spiker that can beat common Defog users Latias, Latios, and support Arceus with Toxic and Roost, enabling it to very reliably set up Spikes.

Life Orb

4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Timid

252 Speed EVs with a Timid nature allow Shaymin-S to outspeed everything up to Darkrai while Speed tying with other Shaymin-S. 252 Special Attack EVs maximize Shaymin-S's power to help with wallbreaking. 4 Defense EVs give Genesect a Special Attack boost while keeping an odd HP value so that Shaymin-S takes less residual damage.

Choice Scarf

4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe Timid

A Choice Scarf, 252 Speed EVs, and a Timid nature allow Shaymin-S to outspeed the majority of the Ubers metagame, including most common other Choice Scarf users; they also allow Shaymin-S to outspeed Jolly Mega Salamence after a Dragon Dance. 4 Defense EVs give Genesect the Special Attack boost while keeping an odd HP value so that Shaymin-S can take an extra round of Stealth Rock damage. 252 Special Attack EVs maximize Shaymin-S's power, which is otherwise mediocre. Choice Scarf Shaymin-S primarily functions by using unmatched Speed to revenge kill threats.


B Rank

Defensive

252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD Sassy / Careful

A Sassy nature and 0 Speed IVs are used so that Gyro Ball does maximum damage. Maximum HP and Special Defense investment is so that Aegislash can fulfill its primary purpose of checking Geomancy Xerneas. The remaining EVs are thrown into Defense to help soften physical attacks.


Support

252 Def / 252 SpD / 4 Spe Calm

Maximum Special Defense investment makes the best of Blissey's high special bulk. 252 Defense EVs allow Blissey to survive some weaker physical hits. The remaining 4 EVs are placed in Speed, because additional power is not needed and 0 HP EVs gives Blissey an odd HP value so that it takes less damage from entry hazards; additionally, Blissey's already high HP stat makes HP investment less efficient. If using Leftovers, 20 HP EVs should be taken out of Defense to hit an HP value that is divisible by 16 to maximize passive recovery. 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD is a viable alternative spread that gives Blissey maximum special bulk, but this comes at the cost of making Blissey extremely physically frail. Natural Cure allows Blissey to function as a status absorber by switching into status and pivoting to a teammate, removing the status condition at no cost.

Physically Defensive

248 HP / 248 Def / 12 Spe Bold

Physically defensive Clefable serves as a check to Swords Dance Arceus formes, Latias, Latios, and some Mega Mewtwo X variants while also providing support for its team through Wish and Heal Bell. Unaware enables Clefable to wall Swords Dance Arceus formes by ignoring their Attack boosts. 12 Speed EVs allow Clefable to outspeed Tyranitar with no Speed investment. 248 HP EVs give Clefable an odd HP value while also maximizing physical bulk alongside 248 Defense EVs and a Bold nature, something that is particularly important given Clefable's mediocre Defense stat.

Specially Defensive

248 HP / 248 SpD / 12 Spe Calm

Unaware gives Clefable the ability to counter setup sweepers such as Geomancy Xerneas and Calm Mind Arceus. 12 Speed EVs allow Clefable to outspeed Tyranitar with no Speed investment. 248 HP and Special Defense EVs with a Calm nature maximize Clefable's special bulk so that it can best take on Xerneas and Arceus while keeping an odd HP value to reduce damage from entry hazards.

Physically Defensive

248 HP / 248 Def / 12 Spe Impish

12 Speed EVs allow Groudon to outspeed Diancie before it Mega Evolves and slay it with Precipice Blades. The rest of the EVs go to HP and Defense, with an Impish nature to maximize Groudon's physical bulk. Do not bother with any other EV spread - chances are Primal Groudon does it better.


Standard Physical Attacker
252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly

252 Attack EVs are used to help Mega Kangaskhan maximize damage output from her priority moves. 252 Speed EVs with a Jolly nature are used so that Mega Kangaskhan can outspeed relevant threats such as Primal Groudon, Primal Kyogre, Dialga, Rayquaza, Yveltal, and Xerneas. An Adamant nature can be used to allow Mega Kangaskhan to hit slightly harder at the cost of forfeiting the guarantee to outspeed the previously listed Pokemon.


Trapping Wobb

28 HP / 228 Def / 252 SpD Calm

The given EV spread allows Wobbuffet to maximize its ability to survive specail attacks while also providing more Leftovers recovery with the 28 EVs invested into HP. The EVs can be tweaked for Wobbuffet to check certain Pokemon, such as investing in Defense for Blaziken and Ho-Oh.


Choice Scarf

252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe Naughty

Maximum investment in Attack and Speed is necessary for Zekrom to hit as hard and as quickly as possible. A Naughty nature is preferred over Naive in order to 2HKO Electric-neutral, bulky variants of Arceus with Bolt Strike. Teravolt is useful for dealing serious damage to Lugia through Multiscale.

Life Orb/Life Orb Tailwind Zek

252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe Naughty

Maximum investment in Attack and Speed is necessary for Zekrom to hit as hard and as quickly as possible. A Naughty nature is preferred over Naive because Zekrom finds maximum Attack to be more useful than maximum Speed. Teravolt is useful to OHKO Lugia through Multiscale. If running Focus Blast, an EV spread of 160 Atk / 96 SpA / 252 Spe can be used to always 2HKO Ferrothorn.

Choice Band

252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe Adamant / Naughty

Maximum investment in Attack and Speed make Zekrom hit as hard and as quickly as possible. An Adamant nature is preferred to boost Zekrom's Attack and not lower its defenses, though Naughty can be used if you do not wish to lower the power of Volt Switch. Teravolt allows Zekrom's Bolt Strike to OHKO Lugia through Multiscale.


B- Rank

Calm Mind

248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe Timid

248 HP EVs give Ice Arceus the bulk it needs to check Mega Salamence and Rayquaza while minimizing Stealth Rock damage at the same time. Maximum Speed EVs and a Timid nature allow Ice Arceus to, at worst, tie with other Arceus formes and Mega Salamence. The rest of the EVs are put into Special Attack; however, relinquishing the HP EVs to maximize Special Attack is an option to allow Ice Arceus to 2HKO Ho-Oh with a +1 Thunder, something that cannot be done with 8 Special Attack EVs.


Blaze Is Back

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Adamant

Maximum Attack and Speed investment give Blaziken the immediate strength that it is most well-known for, immediately putting it to work upon entering the battlefield. An Adamant nature should always be used, as it secures some key OHKOs such as those on Latios and Latias with Knock Off and offensive Kyogre with Low Kick. The slashes represent two possible sets; Protect + 3 attacks or Swords Dance + 3 attacks. A set of Swords Dance + Protect + 2 attacks can be used, but Blaziken will miss the coverage against Mega Salamence or the Giratina formes. If the opportunity cost of using Mega Blaziken is too much for one to even consider using it, do realize that Life Orb is a fine replacement over the Blazikenite. The two main concerns of using Life Orb is the added 10% recoil after every landed attack and the more fragile 80 / 70 / 70 bulk, meaning Blaziken will be worn down even faster to Flare Blitz recoil and be even further susceptible to priority attacks. However, normal Blaziken with a Life Orb is, in fact, slightly stronger than Mega Blaziken, and the open Mega slot can vastly expand teambuilding possibilities.


Choice Scarf

248 Atk / 8 SpA / 252 Spe Naive / Hasty

A Naive nature is preferred on Genesect in order to sponge priority attacks better, but Hasty is required on sets with Extreme Speed or Blaze Kick due to legality issues. The above spread allows Genesect to hit hard physically with U-turn while giving its Special Attack an extra point after a Download boost. If you want more offense or bulk on Genesect, a spread of either 252 Atk / 72 SpA / 184 Spe or 72 HP / 248 Atk / 8 SpA / 184 Spe with a Hasty or Naive nature can outspeed all Choice Scarf base 90 Speed Pokemon while having the option of hitting harder with Ice Beam or taking hits from priority such as Extreme Speed better.


Ubers Physical WallBreaker

252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe Jolly

Justified is chosen as Lucario's ability, allowing it to boost its Attack right after it switches into Dark-type attacks. Lucarionite lets Lucario Mega Evolve, and gives it a huge power boost and Adaptability, which doubles the power of Lucario's STAB attacks. Maximum EVs in Attack ensure Lucario hits its foes as hard as possible. The EVs in Speed backed up by a Jolly nature let Lucario outspeed several Pokemon in the tier such as max Speed Xerneas, max Speed Salamence, and max Speed Kyurem-W.


"X-Wing" Physical Attacker

136 HP / 196 Atk / 176 Spe Jolly/Adamant

136 HP EVs are to ensure that Mega Metagross will always survive a +2 Focus Blast from Geomancy Xerneas. 176 Speed EVs with a Jolly nature allow Mega Metagross to outspeed all Pokemon with base 100 Speed and lower. The remaining investment is funneled into Attack to further Mega Metagross's offensive presence. An Adamant nature is an option to further increase Mega Metagross's sheer power; however, note that the Speed investment should be altered as a result, such as running 136 Speed EVs to still outpace Adamant Rayquaza while contributing the remainder to the Attack stat. An alternative spread of 248 HP / 124 Atk / 136 Spe with an Adamant nature allows Mega Metagross to always survive a +1 Adamant Mega Salamence's Earthquake while still outspeeding up to Adamant Rayquaza and retaining some offensive power. Clear Body is preferred as the ability prior to Mega Evolution in order to block Attack drops from Intimidate.


Pursuit Trapper / Momentum gainer

248 Atk / 60 Atk / 200 SpD Adamant

248 HP EVs are used to raise Mega Scizor's overall bulk and help with the ability to use Roost. 60 Attack EVs with an Adamant nature guarantee that Mega Scizor can 2HKO 200HP Xerneas. The remaining 200 EVs are allocated into Special Defense to compensate for Mega Scizor's lower special bulk and to grant it the ability to tank Hidden Power Fire from Mega Gengar.
 
Last edited:

Peli

name elevated but i still act average
This thread will be updated alongside the current Viability Rankings, so mons that come into the above ranks with be added and the mons that drop out will be taken out!
 

haxiom

God's not dead.
is a Top Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
This is pretty cool! I feel like there are a few things that should be added though:

: I think a fully special defensive set should be listed here. It's at least viable, and I do use it over the 56+ Defense spread on teams where I need more security vs Primal Kyogre and Xerneas, and physical attackers like Extreme Killer Arceus are checked by other members of the team.

: Adamant Extreme Killer Arceus is viable I think, it doesn't outspeed Mega Gengar before evolving but Mega Gengar is not as relevant as in XY and often runs Protect anyways. I don't know if you want to do a bulky Adamant spread or simply slash it with Jolly; you could probably get away with pretty minimal Speed investment for a bulky spread, as 16 Speed EVs outspeeds neutral max Speed base 90s.

: I'd maybe mention 168 Speed under Geomancy to outspeed Adamant Excadrill in Sand? It's a borderline case I think.

: Might be worth mentioning 180 SpA / 76 SpD / 252+ Spe which survives a +2 Moonblast. Just a small mention or something. Also the font is a bit weird for the first set.

: Modest spreads should be added in my opinion, they're definitely more used with the current metagame trends.

You made a typo under Lugia that should be "Bold".

: I don't think I've ever seen or thought of using Choice Scarf, and I don't think it's that good but it's up to you if you want to keep it.

: No mention of SubSeed? I think it should be added- 44 HP / 212 SpA / 252 Spe (44 HP EVs hits a Leftovers number). EDIT: By the way, I don't think this spread is optimal anymore, xDesch explained why and I agree I think.

: Shuca Berry Hone Claws set is pretty good, not sure what spread to use though. It is currently going through the QC process.


That's all I have for now; nice resource.
 
Last edited:
You mix up jolly and timid quite frequently, also lugia runs enough speed for rayquaza which would be 136 evs.

Adamant ekiller is an alternative that has seen use and should be added.

Wallceus is still terrible please remove.

I don't get the mmy v lo m2 talk, it's not about which moves you run, it's about what your team is.

Ferro should speed creep (if this isn't allowed then lol @ actually helping out) and run power whip > therefore the nature shouldn't be sassy. I guess gyro has some uses so you can slash the natures.

Since Deo-s needs to run skill swap, timid would be standalone nature on that to avoid confusion.

I like this aegislash:

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 236 HP / 108 Atk / 20 Def / 144 SpD
Careful Nature
- King's Shield
- Iron Head
- Toxic
- Pursuit

Nice thread idea.
 
Last edited:

Minority

Numquam Vincar
is a Tiering Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
You mix up jolly and timid quite frequently
Specifically:

~ support and CM Ghostceus should be Timid
~ SD Arc Ground should be Jolly

~ Deo-A can also run 252 Spe no + nature

There are also DD Mega Mence spreads other than 252+ / 252 / 124 like 176 / 204 and even more that mess around with other stats if you were curious.
 

Starmei

You thought you could challenge me?
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Not gonna quote his post b/c i'm too lazy but replying to what Hack said:

Wallceus - I agree that Wallceus is pretty mediocre and I would never use it but this thread isn't really about how good a set is and isn't recommending you to use anything. Just giving potential spreads. But there's no point giving spreads for unviable mons so that would need to be discussed in further detail. However, there's no harm in keeping it on so...

Deo-S - Skill swap is not mandatory or 'needed'. It's a good move on Deo and very helpful but isn't required on it. So mention it in the description Peli but it's not a mandatory move

Also peli, some of the natures are a tad messed up. As mentioned Arc-Ghost CM needs to be Timid, Ground needs to be jolly, CM Latios has no nature, Lugia's nature is not 'Bolg', ferro and Aegi should be slashed between Sassy and Careful and possibly 1 or 2 more that I missed
 
Not gonna quote his post b/c i'm too lazy but replying to what Hack said:

Wallceus - I agree that Wallceus is pretty mediocre and I would never use it but this thread isn't really about how good a set is and isn't recommending you to use anything. Just giving potential spreads. But there's no point giving spreads for unviable mons so that would need to be discussed in further detail. However, there's no harm in keeping it on so...

Deo-S - Skill swap is not mandatory or 'needed'. It's a good move on Deo and very helpful but isn't required on it. So mention it in the description Peli but it's not a mandatory move

Also peli, some of the natures are a tad messed up. As mentioned Arc-Ghost CM needs to be Timid, Ground needs to be jolly, CM Latios has no nature, Lugia's nature is not 'Bolg', ferro and Aegi should be slashed between Sassy and Careful and possibly 1 or 2 more that I missed
Yes skill swap is mandatory... Its the only way standard HO doesnt autolose to magic bounce+lugia. What else are you gonna run btw? And dont get me started on the bs about "no harm in keeping bad sets". You could at least have provided sensible arguments for your opinions dude, saying "skill swap is just a good move" doesnt quantify shit for example
 
This is pretty cool! I feel like there are a few things that should be added though:

: No mention of SubSeed? I think it should be added- 44 HP / 212 SpA / 252 Spe (44 HP EVs hits a Leftovers number)
A Leftovers number is not optimal on a Substitute set, because you won't be able to set up 5 subs in a row, like you could if you used some other number. The Substitute + Leftovers number I use is *anything divisible by 16* - 1. Basically just make it 40 HP EVs and the set is optimal.
You mix up jolly and timid quite frequently, also lugia runs enough speed for rayquaza which would be 136 evs.
I like this aegislash:

Aegislash @ Leftovers
Ability: Stance Change
EVs: 236 HP / 108 Atk / 20 Def / 144 SpD
Careful Nature
- King's Shield
- Iron Head
- Toxic
- Pursuit
You should know that when investing in both defenses, you should start by having max HP (if less they have a massive HP Base Stat, like Blissey or Wobbufett), something your does not have. Take 8 EVs from both Def and SpD and put them in HP, and you get this spread (ignoring the Attack stat for now): 252 HP / 12 Def / 136 SpD, which is a better spread. You can go and calc the difference if you want to and find out that this spread is better both physically defensively and specially defensively.

Anyways, I'd like to share some of my Ho-Oh spreads that optimizes his HP stat with different factors (i.e. Life Orb, SR, Regeneration, Bad Dreams, Substitute, Recover etc.)

Choice Band set


EVs: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe
EVs: 88 HP / 252 Atk / 168 Spe
EVs: 136 HP / 252 Atk / 120 Spe
EVs: 184 HP / 252 Atk / 72 Spe
EVs: 232 HP / 252 Atk / 24 Spe
Adamant Nature

Life Orb set (without Substitute)

EVs: 64 HP / 252 Atk / 192 Spe
EVs: 184 HP / 252 Atk / 72 Spe
Adamant Nature

Life Orb + Substitute

EVs: 64 HP / 252 Atk / 192 Spe
Adamant Nature


Of course, these spreads may not be super-practical, So take it with a grain of salt. They have very optimal HP values for their sets and what they do and is effective in that way. Sadly, only the Choice Band set has a lot of variations which are equally as optimal, while the Life Orb variants are restricted to 1 and 2 sets. The spreads already listed are also good and should be used if you want to live +2 Thunder from Xern.

Edit: In the OP it says that you've seen "Ho-Oh's only being able to switch in on Stealth Rocks once, but that implies they have Pressure instead of Regen, you should try to put a better example there...
 
Last edited:
I almost never see the mixed groudon though, usually it's just double dance or SR :p
I hate fighting wallceus.
 

Krauersaut

h.t.d.t.
is a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnus
just a little nitpick, shaymin-s should be running 0 evs in hp for optimal leech seed recovery :^]

if u doubt me it loses 2% HP per substitute from 248 hp ho-oh. try it its hilarious
 
Yeah, nice input. I'm pretty sure this could be discussed and researched a lot more, and I don't think this is the absolute best place to do so, but this is definitely an interesting topic. How much of your bulk are you willing to sacrifice for more Leech Seed recovery? I am not exactly sure what Haxiom had in mind when he made the spread, whether it lives an important hit after SR, or if he just wanted more bulk. Personally, I'd be slightly hesitant with lowering your bulk too much (we're talking about removing 1/8 of its total HP), as you now rely a lot on not getting hit at all and getting up a cycle. You also get more priority-prone. Regardless, I think it can absolutely be worth it. The way I see it, you can choose from these four spreads, depending on how much bulk and how much Leech Seed recovery you want;

40 EV --> 351 HP
25 IV --> 335 HP
9 IV --> 319 HP
0 IV ---> 310 HP

the three first maximize Leftovers-recovery while still letting you get 5 subs, the last one is purely for Leech Seeding only. The three last allows for full investment in SpA (or mixed bulk if that's your thing), as well. It'd be nice if someone else could provide calcs and good reasonings as of which spread is most optimal.
 
Last edited:

Thugly Duckling

I play TCG now
I know this from remembering a very old analysis, but SubSeed shaymin-s should be running 26 HP IVs to maximize leech seed recovery. Also allows for max special attack unlike the new spread, which can help if your team is weak to Kyogre.

The new spread really isn't optimized because you recover less HP with it and also don't hit as hard. 26 HP IVs is the way to go
 
I know this from remembering a very old analysis, but SubSeed shaymin-s should be running 26 HP IVs to maximize leech seed recovery. Also allows for max special attack unlike the new spread, which can help if your team is weak to Kyogre.

The new spread really isn't optimized because you recover less HP with it and also don't hit as hard. 26 HP IVs is the way to go
But why 26, and not 25? Must have been a somewhat lacking analysis (or you remembering the wrong number, maybe), as that only gives Shaymin the ability to only make 4 subs, and not 5. And as I said, I don't really know what Haxiom had in mind when making that spread, so there could be something to it. But I still agree, I'd pick the 25 IV HP, personally.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: hyw
Ok none of these numbers make any sense... I can see the argument of 0 (more % recovery from leach seed) and 31 (for bulk) you can ofc go with a balance but these numbers are p much random from what I can see. However, if I'm realistic 31 will always be the best option in practice, you really see a leftovers skymin sub enough to get to a scenario where it would make a difference to have 0. (there's also a LO number you can try to hit (30iv?) but that's not relevant to this discussion)
 
Alright, here's my custom spread for two Pokemon that I love to use-Yveltal and Genesect. Both of these mons are played with assault vest, to further aid their EVs.

YVELTAL:

252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Atk Impish Nature

This here EV spread is oprtimized to 100% survive a SD Extremekiller, even through rocks. It can follow through with a variety of moves, it's most notable being Foul Play.

GENESECT:

252 HP / 252 SpDef / 4 Atk Hasty Nature

Genesect here can switch in on Xerneas and, thanks to it's EVs, 100% survive any of it's moves. It can follow through, thanks to its ability, with a boosted Iron Head and finish with Extremespeed.

Well, there they are. I apologize if my post didn't follow it's designated structure, but I couldn't see any post that outlined that.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top