Metagame NP: NU (beta): Welcome to the NU Age (Combusken Banned)

[viol and bass]

It seems to me that rock-types in general got a big boost from this tier shift. Virizion, Durant, and Doublade were all setup sweepers that had STAB moves that are super-effective against Rock. In addition, now that the two best (by a longshot) steel-types in the tier (one also being a Ghost-type; both being physically defensive) have left, rock-types rush in to fill their place as physically bulky normal/flying resists.

Plus, let's be honest, this tier has some DAMN good rocks in Rhydon, Golem, Barbaracle, etc. They were just being held back somewhat by the fucking amazing steel-types and Virizion.

QuakeEdge is finally good coverage again.

Edit: also seems like fire-spam will take a beating with all three rising mons (fuck shuckle) being weak to fire and with rocks getting a big boost.

 

[Evilfaic]

Welp, I'm having a difficult time replacing Virizion and Durant on my team, but they were both broken as hell, and I'm glad they're gone. Especially Durant, who I now want to try in RU...

 

[canno]

On a more constructive note, Feraligatr and Samurott are both happy that Virizion is gone, especially Samurott since Virizion can tank Ice Beams with its giant SpDef and Megahorn is neutral on it. Also, if there is a rise in rock-types, then both these water-types will have a field day.

Also does Archeops even need Heat Wave now? There's no Durant or Doublade for it to smack about, and everything else I can think of gets smacked by Earth Power, except for based Bronzor (new meta)

EDIT: Derp, Doublade would get smacked by Earth Power anyways.

 

[Azulart]

Ditto is in NU aswell? I'm amazed, I thought he was very favored in OU with a choice scarf.

The NU tier looks alright, one thing is for sure due the presence of fairies alot of NU poison types crawled out of NU and got higher this gen.

Well time to build an proper NU team, I always loved NU.

 

[g]

On a more constructive note, Feraligatr and Samurott are both happy that Virizion is gone, especially Samurott since Virizion can tank Ice Beams with its giant SpDef and Megahorn is neutral on it. Also, if there is a rise in rock-types, then both these water-types will have a field day.

Also does Archeops even need Heat Wave now? There's no Durant or Doublade for it to smack about, and everything else I can think of gets smacked by Earth Power, except for based Bronzor (new meta)

EDIT: Derp, Doublade would get smacked by Earth Power anyways.

Knock offfffffff reks Bronzor
Gourgeist has lost a lot of utility as it was a stop to Durant, Virizion and a lot of Web Sweepers like Zangoose. It was also a check to Doublade thanks to Willowisp

 

[chimpact]

Magneton is a great pokemon, but i'm definitely a fan of the eviolite set in nu over the specs set. Specially defensive steelix is an amazing deterrent for magneton, and seismitoed is also pretty popular (among other mons). There's so many more popular answers for magneton in nu than there are in RU. SPecs is so reliant on prediction, but if you hit that seismitoed on the switch with hp grass, you probably get a kill everytime magneton comes in.The risk outweighs the reward though as you can give your opponent some free turns if/when you make the wrong prediction.

Despite that even with analytic eviolite doesnt hit hard enough :[[.

I think magneton won't stay in NU for long as people will begin to realize how great it is in ru and use it more, but in NU the pokemon that handle it are pretty common.

 

[Azulart]

I just noticed but, how come the NU list doesn't show all the mons that should be in it?
I mean where is Kingler and furret for example.

 

[scorpdestroyer]

I just noticed but, how come the NU list doesn't show all the mons that should be in it?
I mean where is Kingler and furret for example.

Those things didn't make enough usage to go onto the list. I don't exactly know how it works but if it doesn't get used enough by good players, it doesn't count. Sort of how you can use random nonsense like Metang and Dusclops in OU but it doesn't show up because they're irrelevant

and yes Kingler and Furret are irrelevant

 

[Azulart]

Those things didn't make enough usage to go onto the list. I don't exactly know how it works but if it doesn't get used enough by good players, it doesn't count. Sort of how you can use random nonsense like Metang and Dusclops in OU but it doesn't show up because they're irrelevant

and yes Kingler and Furret are irrelevant

I see, thanks for the quick answer. I guess the mons that did not make the list can play in every tier.

 

[cacturne]

and yes Kingler and Furret are irrelevant

:[[
I know it sucks it just hurts kingler is being specifically picked on :/

 

[SotheBlacKnight]

So with Shuckle gone we have to find a new sticky Web user, I've had a couple of matches with this set and I feel comfortable to present it:


Masquerain @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 8 Spd / 248 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sticky Web
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Scald / Air Slash
- Roost

Sure it's not perfect and a well aimed STAB Stone Edge can OHKO it but all the bulk gives it enough to do what it's made for and maybe come back and Intimidate something later. All the moves are obvious Scald to burn, U-turn / Baton Pass to gain momentum, and Roost to heal. Although you could run Quiver dance and Air Slash over this set to be a worse Venomoth but I'm just using it for Sticky Web. Again not perfect but it can get the job done and be a little surprising to boot.

Pair it with the usual Hyper/Bulky offense teammates: Sawk, Sigilyph, Malamar and just watch them lay waste to your opponent.
I also like to pair this with AV Laturn to compliment their typings though Rocks can be a problem but after a Sticky Web Lanturn should be able knock them out.

 

[Anna says hi]

Ariados can set up Toxic Spikes as well, and has Insomnia. Doesn't have as much 4MSS as Masquerain as well.
Sure, it's a suicide lead, but it's not hard to keep hazards up on their side with amazing spinblockers and crappy defoggers. (And Defiant Primeape, who doesn't need a scarf thanks to web.)
Web/TSpikes/Protect/Megahorn seems decent in NU.

 

[GlassGlaceon]

Ariados can set up Toxic Spikes as well, and has Insomnia. Doesn't have as much 4MSS as Masquerain as well.
Sure, it's a suicide lead, but it's not hard to keep hazards up on their side with amazing spinblockers and crappy defoggers. (And Defiant Primeape, who doesn't need a scarf thanks to web.)
Web/TSpikes/Protect/Megahorn seems decent in NU.

uh shiftry ?_?

 

[Evilfaic]

So my team of Omastar/Magmortar/Sigilyph/Virizion/Durant/Hariyama is becoming Omastar/Magmortar/Sigilyph/Shiftry/Hariyama/?. I have no clue what to put in the last slot (ideally I want another Physical threat). I also have no clue if I should run the annoying Stored Power/Cosmic Power/Psycho Shift/Roost set on Sigilyph or the LO + 4 attacks set.

 

[Flareon]

uh shiftry ?_?

I'd have thought Primeape would deter shiftry from switching in.

 

[cacturne]

well defoggers were all being described as shitty by a user and glass was just saying in general that shiftry is a pretty good defogger not that it can beat primeape (but it can)

 

[EV]

I'd have thought Primeape would deter shiftry from switching in.

that x4 U-turn weakness would agree

 

[cacturne]

that x4 U-turn weakness would agree

if shiftry user can predict the switch in on a predicted defog it can kill ape with leaf storm or knock off its item depending so... primeape doesnt get in for free

 

[SotheBlacKnight]

So my team of Omastar/Magmortar/Sigilyph/Virizion/Durant/Hariyama is becoming Omastar/Magmortar/Sigilyph/Shiftry/Hariyama/?. I have no clue what to put in the last slot (ideally I want another Physical threat). I also have no clue if I should run the annoying Stored Power/Cosmic Power/Psycho Shift/Roost set on Sigilyph or the LO + 4 attacks set.

I think the standard Stored Power set isn't that great (it takes too long and is stopped by Dark types), personally the 4 attacks LO set has worked wonders for me though you could always run 3 attacks + Roost if you want some recovery for it:


Sigilyph @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psyshock
- Air Slash
- Heat Wave
- Energy Ball

This is what I run and again it's been really good for me, Air Slash and Heat Wave have great coverage except to Rock types but that is what Energy Ball is for and Psyshock deals with Specially Bulky pokes like Lanturn and Dragalge. You can also run Ice Beam, Dazzling Gleam, or Shadow Ball and Roost, honestly it depends what you think is best for your team.

As for something to replace Durant, Sawk is powerful but is best with Sticky Web or you could use Barbaracle as it is the most dangerous Set-up poke currently.

 

[thdhted]

ok so now that verizion is gone this fellow can shine:
kecleon@ leftovers
ability:protean
252hp/252sp atk/4 def
modest nature
nasty plot
fire blast/flamethrower
ice beam
recover/thunderbolt

now I'm sure you're thinking: why would I use this over frogadeir?well the biggest difference between the two is the fact that kecleon can run nasty plot as a boosting move while frogadeir has only power-up-punch. The second difference is recover, allowing kecleon to quickly heal up after taking a hit. The final difference is thunderbolt, which frogadeir lacks. Another difference is a presence of actual bulk and an ability to go mixed and run a priority move.

 

[HispanicPanic]

ok so now that verizion is gone this fellow can shine:
kecleon@ leftovers
ability:protean
252hp/252sp atk/4 def
modest nature
nasty plot
fire blast/flamethrower
ice beam
recover/thunderbolt

now I'm sure you're thinking: why would I use this over frogadeir?well the biggest difference between the two is the fact that kecleon can run nasty plot as a boosting move while frogadeir has only power-up-punch. The second difference is recover, allowing kecleon to quickly heal up after taking a hit. The final difference is thunderbolt, which frogadeir lacks. Another difference is a presence of actual bulk and an ability to go mixed and run a priority move.

I like the idea behind this, but even with an NP boost, you're still not hitting terribly hard. After all, Kecleon only has base 60 SpA which means that it absolutely needs a boost before it starts doing decent damage with your set. The special bulk is nice, but you're not living many physical hits any time soon. I think I prefer the physical Protean set if only for the fact that base 90 Atk is actually usable before a boost.

 

[SotheBlacKnight]

So I know that I've just talked about a Masquerian set but I feel this is something that could be discussed (if not already) further.

So from my personal experience in NU I feel that the best team/playstyle is Sticky Web Offense, I have had great success with it and NU has a ton of good pokes who benefit from it (Sawk, Malamar, Sigilyph to name a few). There are also some great spin blockers (Spiritomb, Gourgiest) and Defiant pokes (Primeape, Purugly) to stop spins or take advantage of Defog.
But with the recent tier shift we just lost our best Webber, Shuckle and the playstlye became a little harder for it. Though not all hope is lost since we still have plenty of Webbers in NU still, unfortunately thery're not all that good but I'd like to go over briefly what choices there are:


Masquerian
70/60/62/80/82/60
Pros: Intimidate, Great Movepool (access to powerful Water attacks)
Cons: x4 weakness to Rocks, poor stats
Possible Set:
Masquerain @ Focus Sash
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sticky Web
- Air Slash
- Hydro Pump
- Bug Buzz

other set:

Masquerain @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 8 Spd / 248 HP / 252 Def
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sticky Web
- U-turn / Baton Pass
- Scald / Air Slash
- Roost

Leavanny
75/103/80/70/80/92
Pros: Good Speed and Attack stats, Magic Coat
Cons: x4 weakness to Fire and Flying, terrible offensive typing
Possible Set:
Leavanny @ Focus Sash
Ability: Swarm / Overcoat
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Sticky Web
- Magic Coat
- X-Scissor / Leaf Blade
- Toxic / Leaf Blade


Swadloon
55/63/90/50/80/42
Pros: Good Bulk with Eviolite, Magic Coat
Cons: sames as Leavanny
Possible Set:
Swadloon @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat (sand is still a thing)
EVs: 252 Def / 248 HP / 8 SDef
Impish Nature
- Sticky Web
- Magic Coat
- Seed Bomb
- Synthesis


Ariados
70/90/70/60/60/40
Pros: Good Attack stat, access to priority (Sucker Punch, Shadow Sneak), Toxic Spikes
Cons: poor Speed, poor offensive typing
Possible Set:
Ariados @ Focus Sash
Ability: Insomnia
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Sticky Web
- Toxic Spikes
- Megahorn / Cross Poison
- Sucker Punch


Kricketune
77/85/51/55/51/65
Pros: Technician Bug Bite, Bitchin' Stache
Cons: Poor typing, poor stats, has nothing to do with sound despite his name
Possible set:
Kricketune @ Focus Sash
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Sticky Web
- Bug Bite
- Power-Up Punch
- Knock Off

I know all of these are similar and I hope more people can present even more sets and possibilities to these rather sad pokes.

 

[Evilfaic]

I think the standard Stored Power set isn't that great (it takes too long and is stopped by Dark types), personally the 4 attacks LO set has worked wonders for me though you could always run 3 attacks + Roost if you want some recovery for it:


Sigilyph @ Life Orb
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psyshock
- Air Slash
- Heat Wave
- Energy Ball

This is what I run and again it's been really good for me, Air Slash and Heat Wave have great coverage except to Rock types but that is what Energy Ball is for and Psyshock deals with Specially Bulky pokes like Lanturn and Dragalge. You can also run Ice Beam, Dazzling Gleam, or Shadow Ball and Roost, honestly it depends what you think is best for your team.

As for something to replace Durant, Sawk is powerful but is best with Sticky Web or you could use Barbaracle as it is the most dangerous Set-up poke currently.

I'll probably try this set (possibly Dazzling Gleam over Air Slash) and I've been testing a few things. My favorite so far is Eviolite Piloswine.

 

[shadowyoshi64]

Leavanny
75/103/80/70/80/92
Pros: Good Speed and Attack stats, Magic Coat
Cons: x4 weakness to Fire and Flying, terrible offensive typing
Possible Set:
Leavanny @ Focus Sash
Ability: Swarm / Overcoat
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Sticky Web
- Magic Coat
- Leaf Blade / X-Scissor
- Knock Off


Swadloon
55/63/90/50/80/42
Pros: Good Bulk with Eviolite, Magic Coat
Cons: sames as Leavanny
Possible Set:
Swadloon @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat (sand is still a thing)
EVs: 252 Def / 248 HP / 8 SDef
Impish Nature
- Sticky Web
- Magic Coat
- Seed Bomb
- Synthesis

I may be wrong, but isn't Magic Coat in the same boat as Knock Off when it comes to having Sticky Web. As Magic Coat is also a 5th gen Move Tutor?

 

[canno]

Leavanny
75/103/80/70/80/92
Pros: Good Speed and Attack stats, Magic Coat
Cons: x4 weakness to Fire and Flying, terrible offensive typing
Possible Set:
Leavanny @ Focus Sash
Ability: Swarm / Overcoat
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Sticky Web
- Magic Coat
- Leaf Blade / X-Scissor
- Knock Off

As someone who uses Leavanny, I can tell you Knock Off + Sticky Web is illegal unfortunately (never tried Magic Coat so idk about that) I personally run Sticky Web / dual STAB / Toxic and run Swarm (Overcoat is only useful vs Hippo, while Swarm can power up X-Scissor a little after Sash. Ability isn't really that important though). Toxic is helpful vs bulky mons. I personally like Leavanny the best because it is the fastest sticky web user.