Heavy offense RMT

[BloodyRoutin]

Azelf @ Light Clay
252 HP / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Ability: Levitate
Timid nature
-Reflect
-Light Screen
-Stealth Rock
-Taunt

DS Azelf is the perfect lead for a heavy offense team. Getting up screens and SR early and preventing others to get their SR is the best thing ever.
It does have problems with lead Aerodactyl (which sucks, get over it, the suckiest lead ever.). Aero and other lead Azelf are the worst of it. Choice scarf leads if they exist could be a problem, and other smart leads who will attack me on the Taunt turn is a problem, otherwise none.

Infernape @ Life Orb
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Ability: Blaze
Jolly nature
-Swords Dance
-Flare Blitz
-Stone Edge
-Close Combat

I used a MixApe but decided SD Ape would be better overall. SD Ape packs a good punch and hits hard.

Lucario @ Life Orb
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP
Ability: Inner Focus
Adamant nature
-Close Combat
-Crunch
-ExtremeSpeed
-Swords Dance

Newest addition to the team, SD Luke is pretty awesome. And fearful.
It's pretty much new to the team, I had Azelf here and Metagross on the lead spot but that changed. So it's a test drive for now, but I am positive of the results.

Gyarados @ Life Orb
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Ability: Intimidate
Jolly nature
-Waterfall
-Ice Fang
-Earthquake
-Dragon Dance

No HO team can be called one without Gyarados. One of the most fearsome sweepers is here for another round of.. sweeping. Pretty much your standard DD Gyarados. I'm kinda unsure about Ice Fang but Stone Edge can miss pretty oftenly and Ice Fang isn't all that bad anyway.

Scizor @ Life Orb
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Technician ability
Adamant nature
-Swords Dance
-Bullet Punch
-Brick Break
-Quick Attack?

SD Scizor packs a punch and clears out my lead Aerodactyl problems, while still maintaining to be an awesome hard hitting member. I'm not sure about the last attack, but Quick Attack looks like the best option.

Salamence @ Life Orb
252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Sp.att
Intimidate ability
Jolly nature
-Dragon Dance
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Fire Blast

DD Mence! Awesomee... Really, my favorite team member besides Latias. Sweeps things like crap after one DD.

Comments:
Taunters, PHazers, and Choice Scarfers ruin my fun. Taunt ruins my stat boosting, PHazers roar them away, and choice scarfers outspeed my Pokemon and can hit them pretty hard.
Yeah, a threat list that was ^. But otherwise not much threats this team. (Other than unusual things. Sorry for sounding so naive.)

So, how is my team? It pretty much wrecks on Shoddy and at Wifi it rocks.

Previous members:

Latias @ Life Orb
252 Sp.att 252 Spe 4 Def
Levitate ability
Timid nature
-Calm Mind
-Dragon Pulse
-Surf
-Recover

CM Latias.. I'm pretty unsure what to say here, really. Latias is awesome and I like her but.. I don't feel like she fits into this team. She did save me sometimes on Shoddy, and made a nice sweep herself. I still need something to replace Recover since I lose momentum that way. I'm thinking about HP Fire but the loss of speed is undesirable.

Kicked 'cause: I was never too sure about her place, and Scizor clears out my Aero lead problems.

 

[george182]

4 set up sweepers, 1 wall breaker, + duel screens

now this team is probably really good, when your in control, but when the oponent is in control, this team will really struggle.

So I suggest changing gyrados to a choice band set, he draws in lucario's and salamences counters and can strike them with great power, preventing them from walling lucario and mence. The imidiate power helps when the oponent has control and you need to smack them with some instant power.

For the same reason I would put specs/scarf on latias, for when you need some instant speed, or some instant power, to take out an oponents poke and regain control.

 

[Sir Azelf]

Not a bad HO since you have Ape + Gyara to overwhelm waters, Luke + Gyara to overwhelm Rotom and the dual dragons etc.

Anyways, those Mence evs suck 252 Att / 252 speed / 6 S.Att @ Jolly please.

Make Gyarados Jolly to beat Jolteon and also ScarfTran after a boost. Specs/LO Jolt slaying your whole team is the last thing you need.

Id try and find a place for SD Scizor though, a play style that auto loses to lead Aero is rather sad so you need something to take it out since it shuts down Azelf, hits alot of your team for SE and the only thing that doesnt is Latias who takes heavy damage from Stone Edges.

 

[BloodyRoutin]

I'll might give Scizor a go again instead of Latias. She wasn't as good as she was with my previous team. I had Scizor on my other team too, and it was SD Scizor, perhaps it will have more success on this team.
I'll remove Lati and get Scizor in.

 

[george182]

Not a bad HO since you have Ape + Gyara to overwhelm waters, Luke + Gyara to overwhelm Rotom and the dual dragons etc.

Anyways, those Mence evs suck 252 Att / 252 speed / 6 S.Att @ Jolly please.

Make Gyarados Jolly to beat Jolteon and also ScarfTran after a boost. Specs/LO Jolt slaying your whole team is the last thing you need.

Id try and find a place for SD Scizor though, a play style that auto loses to lead Aero is rather sad so you need something to take it out since it shuts down Azelf, hits alot of your team for SE and the only thing that doesnt is Latias who takes heavy damage from Stone Edges.

? Ape + gyra to overwhelm waters, lets take the most common bulky water, vaporeon, vaporeon is NOT countered by either ape or gyrados, and the most common set contains surf + HP electric, which makes vaporeon a counter to both ape + gyra. Vaporeon can OHKO both while even a nastyplot max sp.atk grass knot fails to OHKO vaporeon, and gyrados' stab will just heal vaporeon.

Lucario + gyra to overwhelm rotom? scarf rotom-h the most common rotom form, can counter both OHKOing each with thunderbolt and overheat respectively, rotom doesn't even need to take a hit.

those mence ev's suck? so you gave him some even worse ev's that make fire blast useless, try 232 atk/24sp.atk/252 speed the 24 sp.atk ensures a OHKO on scarmory before it can wirlwind you away, and a 2hko on bronzong, you will also need a naive nature, as jolly lowers your sp.atk

scizor is good with bugbite instead of quick attack, a new HGSS move, bug bite has 60 base power, but is boosted by technician to 90, and then boosted by stab to 135 base power, it can 2hko any bulky water, apart form gyrados. If your using max speed, I would use superpower, as you won't mind the defence drop, and it allows you to OHKO oposing scizor, which is a big thing, and 2hko skarmory, which means neither can counter you.

 

[SandslashPWNS]

4 set up sweepers, 1 wall breaker, + duel screens

now this team is probably really good, when your in control, but when the oponent is in control, this team will really struggle.

So I suggest changing gyrados to a choice band set, he draws in lucario's and salamences counters and can strike them with great power, preventing them from walling lucario and mence. The imidiate power helps when the oponent has control and you need to smack them with some instant power.

For the same reason I would put specs/scarf on latias, for when you need some instant speed, or some instant power, to take out an oponents poke and regain control.

There are no choiced pokes in HO. By the way, HO stands for Hyper Offense iirc, not Heavy Offense.

My second point is this: The point of HO is to wear down common checks and counters with similar set up sweepers. Vaporeon and Suicune will quickly go down to a +2 Close Combat followed by a +1 Earthquake after they decide to either switch or kill Infernape. What you're doing is taking this as something other than an HO team.

Thirdly, in most HO teams, all set up sweepers are either physical or special. In this case, Latias doesn't fit.

Lastly, he was talking about the defensive variants of Rotom, which Lucario and Gyarados do overwhelm. I do agree, however, that Scarf Rotom H can pose a threat to this team. Try adding a standard DD Tyranitar over Latias to better compensate for this weakness.

Overall, decent team. Have fun with it and good luck. :D

 

[BloodyRoutin]

What?
I don't get it. Why?
CB or any choice item in general is fail on heavy offense.
I like physical Infernape.
Scizor stays SD. Trainer switched in Swampert.
I do not need a late-game sweeper. MMence is a late game sweeper.

I don't get your whole post, explain it to me plz.

EDIT:
Meant to Overdrive.

EDIT2:
I dunno I'm kinda used to call it Heavy Offense.

 

[SandslashPWNS]

- Turn SD Ape into Nasty Plot MixApe
- Turn SD Scizor into Choice Band Scizor
- Turn DD Mence into New MixMence
Many of your Pokemon need to Swords Dance or Dragon Dance to sweep, giving your opponent a free turn to switch in and Latias is your only special sweeper.

You don't know how Hyper Offense works, do you? Obviously not. I don't mean to sound rude, but you should probably learn what HO is first before you rate.

 

[Sir Azelf]

? Ape + gyra to overwhelm waters, lets take the most common bulky water, vaporeon, vaporeon is NOT countered by either ape or gyrados, and the most common set contains surf + HP electric, which makes vaporeon a counter to both ape + gyra. Vaporeon can OHKO both while even a nastyplot max sp.atk grass knot fails to OHKO vaporeon, and gyrados' stab will just heal vaporeon.

Lucario + gyra to overwhelm rotom? scarf rotom-h the most common rotom form, can counter both OHKOing each with thunderbolt and overheat respectively, rotom doesn't even need to take a hit.

those mence ev's suck? so you gave him some even worse ev's that make fire blast useless, try 232 atk/24sp.atk/252 speed the 24 sp.atk ensures a OHKO on scarmory before it can wirlwind you away, and a 2hko on bronzong, you will also need a naive nature, as jolly lowers your sp.atk

1. Vap loses to Gyarados behind dual screens so yes they do overwhelm counters, you overlook his main strategy, i.e dual screens which are KEY in getting past counters. This opens up a hole for Ape once Gyarados has wrecked it. Assuming the screens arent up is like assuming stall wont get Spikes up, thats what this team does and we should look at what the team can do in best case scenario.

2. Umm i fail to see how they are worse evs than using MixMence Evs on DD Mence like he initially had. :/ Mence has some amazing resistances on the special side so cutting its defenses to OHKO something that doesnt even pose an immediate threat to him or the team seems kinda dumb but w/e.

3. Scarf Rotom is a fucking joke. Besides it cant OHKO Gyara/Lucario through Light Screen (only has a 33% chance on Gyarados through LS with T-Bolt) and who ever Rotom comes in on that poke IS gonna KO it with LS up which as said opens up holes for the other partner.

| Rotom-h | Item | Leftovers | 62.1 |

Also yeah about Scarf Rotom-H being most common...

SandslashPWNS/BloodyRoutin, both said the rest of what i wanted to.

@OP, you said you wanted to try SD Ape on shoddy right ? Well i think you should honestly give that a whirl. SD Ape would go nicely here because it stops Gyarados setting up (Stone Edge) whom could be an issue if it does. That and i feel SD Ape has better synergy with the new addition of Scizor and with Lucario and Gyarados too, it really helps lure and destroy road blocks to all of them. For example Rest Talker Gyarados and Vappy amongst various others even more so now.

Good team though op, seems to have great synergy (which is really something these days. :/), good luck with it.

Ill just leave this here to help any future rates you get. =P

 

[BloodyRoutin]

Yeah I saw that thread, gave me some help with building a team. Although this team looks like a ripoff of that team in the thread.. *Didn't say anything*.
I dislike choice items anyway.

 

[scarloc]

i am cureently running a HO team on shoddy with great success. firstly you don;t need latias. HO team have 1 DS and 5 sweepers. other wise it becomes a normal team. so latias needs to be removed. 2 pokemon need taunt. i suggest gyardos and azelf (azelf already has it so it's fine). other wise phazers ruin you team. replace salamence with anotther special sweeper. i refer gyara to mence because of it's bulk. lastly no choice items so never take one no matter what happens, life orb all the way. this is beacuse HO teams wait till late game to sweep. if your stuck into one move like shadow ball and you opponent takes in blissey....

i suggest either zapdos or porygon-z. both are setup special sweepers

 

[Alan]

Your Infernape only has 3 moves listed.

Just something I saw. Team looks good overall, glad to see Heavy Offense can still work.

 

[Wafle]

I play a HO team as well, and yours is similar to mine. The biggest problem to most HO teams is scarfers and status. I would recommend taunt on one of your other pokes, because status is a major nuisance that can really hamper your ability to sweep.

 

[george182]

You fail to see the point is 24 sp.atk ev's and a naive nature? if your using fire blast its only use is against skarmory, forretress and bronzong, and naive nature + the ev's are needed for the KO's on skarmroy and bronzong. If not you might aswell use flamethrower, or just not bother with the move. But considering that skarmory would give salamence, lucario, scizor and gyrados trouble, and she has a recovery move, as well as whirlwind and stealth rocks will really hurt gyrados and salamence.

HO teams don't attack from both spectrum's? um what are you chatting? lol they can attack from both spectrums, as this weakens and draws in mixed walls and a physical sweeper can then set up on a special wall, then a special sweeper can set up on physical wall etc.

"HO stands for hyper offence, not heavy offence"? again chatting bull again, they are the same thing

If your lead fails and the whole team is based around set up sweepers, you will fail. You need the momentum in your favour and when the screens run out, so does your chance of winning. Choice items, and mixed attackers allow you to achieve this, choice band scizor can use U-turn which keeps the momentum in your favour, and he has pursuit to trap revenge killers, trick allows you to set up on the incoming pokemon, and mixed attackers also provide some instand power and are very useful for wall breaking.

- So use mence ev's of 252 speed/ 24 spatk/ 232 atk with a naive nature, otheriwse don't use fire blast

- Choice band scizor would be great

- Nastyplot mix ape is also a great wall breaker

- Mix mence also really helps break walls

- "scarf rotom only has a 33% chance to OHKO gyrados?" where do you do your calculations, scarf rotom does have max attack and stab thunderbolt, and it does 297-350 damage with screens up after stealth rocks, which are assumed present in all calculations, gyrados will have 248 health left, that is a garunteed OHKO. Let's say we are in your happy world where SR does not exist, then gyrados is holding a life orb, so after one turn of life orb recoil, rotom comes in and bam gyrados is dead, and rotom is still alive to kill his other pokes.

If every poke has a 1 turn set up, and a 1 turn sweep, azelf has one turn to set up the first screen, then another to set up the second, and then another to switch out. Azelf takes 3 turns of the time, and the other 5 turns are not gonna last through every memeber of this team as they all take at least 1 turn to set up, and azelf does not have the bulk to switch back in and try again.

Again this is why instant power is needed to take advantage of the short time screens are up, instead of wasting it by setting up.

This form of set up and sweep constantly combo really does not work in the current metagame, a metagame which is bassed around bulky offense, and you need to enable your team to beat bulky offense, your team seems to be based around beating stall, and tbh, it doesn't look great at that.

Every pokemon needs to set up, and that just gives the opponent an extra turn and wastes one turn of screens. Which is why mix mence, nasty plot infernape, choice band scizor and a lead uxie would be much beter. Scizorz pursuit would trap revenge killers, as they give your team some serious trouble. You can call it whatever tactic you like, a whole team of set up sweepers will not get you very far on the shoddy ladder

 

[Phantom_IV]

Instant power is important in HO, and a single choiced pokemon isn't necessarily bad. Consider adding a CB or Scarf Flygon, as it adds a TWave immunity and hits hard or keeps pressure with UTurn. Oh, and currently Scarf Jirachi wrecks your entire team (bar infernape), able to revenge them after every kill. Lead scarf jirachi will give you issues as well, given how reliant you are on DS.

Have you considered adding a Magnezone? Or perhaps giving Gyara taunt to help with Skarm?

 

[Alan]

Choice Pokemon are considered counter productive to HO teams because they waste a turn of the Screens, which could be used to set up and sweep.

50.8% - 60.4% <--Choice Scarf Jirachi Ice Punch v. Salamence from behind screens, a.k.a. Mence can DD then outspeed and OHKO.

 

[mtr]

Also Choice Pokemon might get locked in on a poor move, giving your opponent a chance to set up.

HO can work, but understand it's limitations: you suffer against teams with a Scarfer and who have prepared for your threats. It can be done, but HO weighs very heavily on the team matchups.

 

[TheAmazingFlygon]

hey nice team you got there! But there's a few things I would like to point out : 1. Switch the nature of your mence to naive because otherwise you will hinder your special attack stat which is not good because you have fire blast, 2. switch Brick Break to Superpower on your Scizor for more damage and quick attack for Bug Bite (honestly I don't see the point of Quick Attack), 3. I would simply test out a Lucario with Bullet Punch over Extremespeed, 4. I would consider switching your Latias to a Tyranitar (Babiri Berry DD) because yes it will hinder you but also Tyranitar would be a great asset to your team.

 

[SatiSuicune]

Hmm, Hyper Offensive teams should always focus on either Physical Attacking or Special Attacking, and since this is a Physical Attacking HO team, may I suggest Agilligross? Agilligross can use agility while the opponent switches to a counter, and then you kill the counter with one of you moves, here's the set:

Metagross @Life Orb
Adamant
Clear Body
112 HP/252 Att/12 Def/132 Speed
Agility
Meteor Mash
Earthquake
Thunder Punch/Ice Punch/Explosion
This Agiligross would work pretty dang well with your team, since Latias shouldn't be on a physical HO team anyways. Good luck with your team and I hope my rate helped!

 

[Wafle]

Sorry, about my previous comments, I've just never really played heavy offense and didn't understand the consept. However, I do think you need another mixed or special sweeper.

That goes against the premise of HO and is counter productive.