The CAP Metagame

[gorm]

did i ever say erase a single time? did i ever once?

i said start fresh, does that imply destruction of any knowledge accumulated? it shouldnt. it meas starting in a stabler metagame that will attract more users why is that not your #1 concern?

we can always always come back to it and refine it. i feel the processes are all deeply flawed and we need to address making abetter one before we address fixing the old ones.

you didnt listen to me when i said i respected the effort =\

 

[Flounder]

did i ever say erase a single time? did i ever once?

i said start fresh, does that imply destruction of any knowledge accumulated? it shouldnt. it meas starting in a stabler metagame that will attract more users why is that not your #1concern?

we can always always come back to it and refine it. i feel the processes are all deeply flawed and we need to address making abetter one before we address fixing the old ones.

you didnt listen to me when i said i respected the effort =\

more caps, better caps with a bette rprocess and more interested poeple involved not people interested in flavour.

we'll see if i am mistaken i guess.

exactly, but apart from sentimenta.l attachment to the effort spent, its much more efficient (if more difficult) to scrap it all

'Scrap it all' pretty strongly implies to get rid of everything, including the CAPs themselves; it also doesn't help that you say we need a better process in the same post.

 

[gorm]

i said something dumb and you have convinced me of that, but i stand behind the fact that you need more users

cap projects should not be erased and should be able to be fixed.

i support 2 ladders for a new evo process and the old cap metagame.

 

[eric the espeon]

There is no need to split the players we have down the middle (and no, it will not encourage more people. It means they have to learn an extra metagame to play all of CaP.).

If you want to propose anything of this sort please make a thread about it, lets not derail X-Acts suggestion further.

 

[tennisace]

did i ever say erase a single time? did i ever once?

i said start fresh, does that imply destruction of any knowledge accumulated? it shouldnt.

Yeah actually thats pretty much what you were implying, starting with a Platinum Metagame where CAP isn't the Platinum Metagame pretty much says: Start over you're wrong.

it meas starting in a stabler metagame that will attract more users why is that not your #1 concern?

"The Create-A-Pokémon project is a community dedicated to exploring and understanding the competitive Pokémon metagame by designing, creating, and playtesting new Pokémon concepts."

That is our number 1 concern. Also, starting in a stabler metagame? How would you say it get stable, get rid of the CAP projects?

we can always always come back to it and refine it. i feel the processes are all deeply flawed and we need to address making abetter one before we address fixing the old ones.

Well then, we have Policy Review threads for these kind of concerns. Also, you may feel the processes are "deeply flawed", but the majority doesn't.

you didnt listen to me when i said i respected the effort =\

Because you're telling us to get rid of said effort, in addition to basically telling us we do nothing for Smogon, we're worthless, and we shouldn't be a sub-forum. Thats hardly respecting the effort.

EDIT:

cap projects should not be erased and should be able to be fixed.

Which is what we're doing right now.

 

[Wichu]

Hey Gorm. If you really think the CAP process and Pokémon should be redone, what's stopping you from making your own version of the CAP project and server?

 

[DougJustDoug]

This thread was opened to discuss the current CAP metagame. This is not a discussion on whether the current CAP's will be deleted or not. It's not going to happen and does not need to be discussed in this topic.

I'd also like everyone to pull back the claws in every post. I know there is a lot of simmering antipathy in the wake of the recent EVO debate -- but it doesn't help the situation by borderline flaming and trolling in every post. And that applies to many of the posts that I have seen in this thread. Everyone try to cool down a bit, and get back to some semblance of normal civil discussion.

And stay on topic, please.

 

[Wichu]

Anyway, back on topic.
As I think was said earlier, 2 ladders won't help. It's rather ironic it was suggested in a thread pointing out there aren't enough players to collect data on; having 2 ladders would split even those into separate groups.
I admit I'm one of the ones who votes in the polls but hasn't been on the server. To be honest, I haven't been on Shoddy for months. However, this is because I'm busy with my game project; if I ever decide to play Shoddy in the future, I'll play the CAP server.
But we still need to get others to play if we want accurate statistics; perhaps people should support CAP in their signatures or something. I'm sure when the CAP website opens, there will be a lot of people joining...

 

[tennisace]

Gorm, EVO isn't going to happen any time soon. Doug said that in his wrap up.

As for our current metagame, time for bullet points!

• Heatran is everywhere. EVERYWHERE. It checks Scizor, Syclant, Skymin, ex cetera. Its one of the biggest threats in the metagame right now, and rightly so.
• Skymin is non-existant, probably because of the Heatran. This suprises me somewhat, since Specs Skymin is a good check to Syclant/Revenanhk.
• Syclant usage is also declining, thanks to Scizor and Heatran completely shutting them down. Expect a drop due to Stratagem.
• Scizor is very popular, and is able to deal >50% to Revenankh on the switch in with Bullet Punch, assuming Life Orb and no SD. However, its kept in check by Heatran, Pyroak, and Zapdos.
• Zapdos is rising in popularity, thanks to Scizor's rise in popularity. It can really shut down all the bulky waters. Zapdos+Heatran can completely wreck unprepared teams. The most common is 3-attack defensive varients, though there are some offensive ones around.
• Pyroak and Fidgit are almost never seen, though Fidgit can really keep you off balance, and Pyroak is quite hard to take down. It can even out-stall Zapdos.
• Dragonite is making a comeback, mixed is the most common. Syclant still beats it soundly.
• Salamence usage is abnormally low, thanks to Syclant.
• Gyarados usage is down too, because of Zapdos.
• Common leads are Azelf, Syclant, and random Trick leads.
• Gengar usage is down because of Revenankh.
• Togekiss usage is way up for now, because its such a good counter to all the CAPs. However expect a drop because of Stratagem.

 

[DougJustDoug]

This thread is going nowhere.

 

[X-Act]

Thanks for fucking up my thread Gorm. At least the original post can still be read for those interested. :(