ORAS PU Sticky webz are cool right?

[RivalET]

These teams underneath show the team i asked you to rate and all the so far by you suggested changes to it.

Original:

importable: http://pastebin.com/Liqi2A8a
Anty's suggested changes to the team:

importable: http://pastebin.com/5Q5gWG9i
Raizas suggested changes to the team

importable: http://pastebin.com/zP5qLwPS
Megazard's suggested changes to the team

importable: http://pastebin.com/1B61wBhd ​

begin story :

so i crafted this team out of a lowladder team i faced laddering going something like ariados/monferno/misdreavus/meganium/probo~some other shitty filler. And after facing it i didn't think was such a bad idea, so i went to teambuilder and made a team of my own based on the same idea, but with more viable mons. crafting leavanny/ferno/probo/rose/pawn/misdre. Over time i changed the team after taking it to the pu room and asking for suggestions for how to improve the team.​

this should showcase the changes made over time:

| monf: SD | nasty plot hp fighting | defensive |

SD -> SR scarf

misdreavus: nasty plot<heal bell | stunfisk: toxic -> stone edge (for cryo)| float: special scarf -> physical scarf
current (before RMT):

misdreavus: heal bell<nasty plot hp fighting<tbolt | float: LO physcially based with double ice | Golem: Spdef

So to the team:

Leavanny
ruin yo leaf

@ Focus Sash
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Sticky Web
- Leaf Storm
- Knock Off
- Electroweb

Leavanny's main job for the team is to get up webz, however this does not mean not mean it should be threaded like an ordinary suicide lead. Instead it should be threaded as a vital team member just like the other mons, which means that it cannot always simply be thrown away to get webs up quickly. Leavanny can pick up clean KO's with leafstorm against mons like marowak, it can knock off key items of off many threads to this team like Clefairy and Machoke's both off which are significant threads to this team.

Monferno
FeelTheFern

@ Eviolite
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Flare Blitz
- Mach Punch
- Swords Dance

Monferno is the main mon of this team and the rest of the team really only helps it do what ferno does best: set up swords dance late game and win. it's important to have the mon around as it counters things like Audino and pawniard, pawniard especially would be an enormous thread to this team as it will be up +2 thanks to sticky lowering it's speed.

Misdreavus
Dhr. DREavus

@ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp
- Thunderbolt
- Nasty Plot

Misdreavus is the spinblocker of the team and is, like monferno, a nice setup sweeper, it can 1v1 opposing fernos thanks to it's immunity to fighting type moves (meaning i can always switch into it when ferno comes out against cryo) and it's ability to 2hko it with shadow ball. it can also cripple mons like gogoat and haxorus with wisp. under webz it outspeeds float and can OHKO it with t-bolt after sr, as well as dodrio's expecting a shadowball.
one thing that misdreavus can setup on particularly easy is avalugg.

Cryogonal
SpookySnow

@ Never-Melt Ice
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 30 Spe
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Recover
- Freeze-Dry
- Rapid Spin

on the other side of the Ile we have our own spinner cryo. cryo is mainly here to spin away annoying hazards which this team really appreciates as none of the mons of this team can really afford being worn down to much (it breaking leavanny's/golem's sash/sturdy; monferno needing to be at an as high as possible health to setup sd and live potential recoil damage from flare blitz afterwards; misdreavus needing it for largely the same reasons and floatzel already being worn down by LO) , though Freeze dry + hp fighting make it so surprisingly little mons in want to switch into it, let alone 1v1 it.
timid to out speed and recover for longlivety.

Floatzel
the S-pecial

@ Life Orb
Ability: Water Veil
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
IVs: 29 HP
- Waterfall
- Ice Beam
- Ice Punch
- Frustration
ah, floatzel what would we be without you? for this team I've chosen physically based LO with double ice, because it fit really well with the rest of the team. the main reasons being that the team needed more physically offensive presence, the fact that i really hate having float being locked into one move, and that double ice makes for a really nice lure for leafyeon, tangela and gourgeist (icebeam OHKO's non yache berry leafyeon after sr) and if it had only used ice beam prior, then it'll also be a solid lure for roselia.

Golem
Chamillionaire

@ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 248 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Rock Blast

since no one got the limp bizcuit reference, i decided to change the name to chamillionaire instead. spdef golem fits a lot of roles in this team: the go to tank; the electric immunity (looking at you volt switch); flying resist; normal resist; the SR setter; anti sash with rock blast and wearing down tanks bulky mons with toxic.

Major Threads,
as can be expected of a webs team there are a lot of mons that threaten it. here are the most major one and how i (try) to deal with them.

Jumpluff
jumpluff is the biggest thread to this team with it's high speed, uneffectedness by sticky webs and a lack of switch ins. this beast usually ends up forcing me to sacrifice a mon and hoping to revenge kill it with floatzel which is the only thing on my team that outspeeds it. a big part of me dealing with it is setting up stealth rocks to limit it's switch ins, making it less of a pain.
these 2 replays showcase the difficulty of dealing with jumpluff, the first one failing and the second one succeeding.​

1. http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-350705968​
2. http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-350718085​

machoke
machoke is a mon that forms far less of a thread then jumpluff, but still usually manages to almost always take 1 or 2 mons with it. though monferno can 1v1 the close combat variant with sd+closecombat as machokes close combat doesn't OHKO, though it needs to be at full health to do so, its variety in the dynamic punch set makes this to much of a risk. so my best bet is the wear it down sacrificing one mon sand then leaving it useless too low of an hp to fight back (preferably using leafanny with knock off+leaf storm)

clefairy
clefairy not being worn down by non attacking moves and high bulk + having recovery and being able to setup is a big pain and the first step in killing it is knocking off it's eviolite and then switching into golem/misdre to kill it by either spamming eq or to setup of my own with misdre and spamming shadow ball untill it dies.

IMPORTABLE
http://pastebin.com/Liqi2A8a​

 

[Anty]

Hi RivalET, nice team. To remove the quote thing i think you have to delete the [quote ] and [/quote ] signs at the start and end.

The team has nice synergy together and covers a lot between them. The best way to check Clefairy and Machoke is hitting them hard with supereffective hits, so I recomend Metang over Golem, which can not only easily switch into clef, do a lot to Machoke with ZHB, but it can also take absolutely nothing from Jumpluff. It still provides things that Golem does Like Normal/Flying resist, and can even pursuit Pyschic types if you chose to run that. The only thing it doesn't give you is an electric immunity, which brings me onto my next suggestion of Zebstrika over Floatzel. Zebstrika still provides you with a fast Pokemon, and also with an Electric resist, but I think its important to have something faster than Floatzel on this team, as if webs do go down, then the team has a huge issue with Floatzel which can potentially KO everything if Missy and Cryo have been weakened and it wins a Speed tie vs your Floatzel.

sets

Metang @ Eviolite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Pursuit / Earthquake
Personally I think Pursuit is best on this team for Psychics but Eq is also nice to bait Stunfisk

Zebstrika @ Life Orb
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Overheat
- Hidden Power Ice

Hope I helped!

 

[Raiza]

Hi RivalET
You already mentioned the majority of threats in the original thread so not much to add there since otherwise it's a decent team and doesn't have many flaws outside of the ones you mentioned. I know you built this team around Monferno, but I think Arbok would do a much better work over Monferno in this team. Even though it is slower, it appreciates Sticky Webs much more and is able to take advantage of them more efficiently. But that's not the main point, the main point is that Arbok will basically help dealing with all 3 of the threats you mentioned. It can switch into both Machoke and Clefairy with ease, and Intimidate also helps it reducing the damage taken by Jumpluff to the minimum. Arbok still carries Coil, and has similiar typing synergy with teammates as Monferno, so I don't see any problem you would encounter by replacing Monferno with Arbok. You could maybe put Arbok over something else too if you really want to keep Monferno, like over Cryogonal, but you then lose the spinner and would be forced to either run Magic Coat on Leavanny or Taunt over Nasty Plot on Misdreavus to counter opposing setters, so in my opinion replacing Monferno is the most efficient option. You like only lose a Fire-type resist but you already have Floatzel and specially defensive Golem so not a big deal.

set

Arbok @ Black Sludge
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Coil
- Gunk Shot
- Sucker Punch
- Earthquake / Aqua Tail

 

[RivalET]

First of all i would like to thank both Anty and Raiza for their well thought of suggestions for changes to the team (and help with the quotation problem), both of which are shown in the new, edited post.
My reason for currently favoring Anty's version over Raizas is that, while arbok does help cover the current top threads, it does open up new holes for different mons to exploit take for instance a core of wisp gourgeist + audino rips through the team, while monferno meant atleast one mon on this team neither could switch into.
meanwhile Anty's suggestion with the introduction of Zebstrika, basicly solves the issue of jumpluff being able to switch into it (either resisting or being immune to both of its STABs) and then OHKO it with either hp ice or overheat. And metang providing more pressure to roselia (which was in the previous team pretty annoying aswell being able to setup hazards and half the team being weak to it) and being able to get free rocks up too.

 

[RivalET]

First of all i would like to thank both Anty and Raiza for their well thought of suggestions for changes to the team (and help with the quotation problem), both of which are shown in the new, edited post.
My reason for currently favoring Anty's version over Raizas is that, while arbok does help cover the current top threads, it does open up new holes for different mons to exploit take for instance a core of wisp gourgeist + audino rips through the team, while monferno meant atleast one mon on this team neither could switch into.
meanwhile Anty's suggestion with the introduction of Zebstrika, basicly solves the issue of jumpluff being able to switch into it (either resisting or being immune to both of its STABs) and then OHKO it with either hp ice or overheat. And metang providing more pressure to roselia (which was in the previous team pretty annoying aswell being able to setup hazards and half the team being weak to it) and being able to get free rocks up too.

i do want to clarify that Anty's version does have its flaws too. For instance, Anty's changes give the team a problematic fire weakness, leaving it with no practical switch ins to any of the current fire type mons (with monferno though resisting fire type moves, with or without webz up, not really wanting to 1v1 any fire type it being the go to setup sweeper of the team, not really liking to get worn down).
Anty's team also switches the team from being (in my opionion) almost perfectly balanced between physical and special with 2 pure physical mons (1 slow and 1 medium); 1 physically based mon ( high speed tier); 1 specially based mon (high speed tier) and 2 pure specials (1 medium and 1 high), to only 2 physical mons and 1 specially based with 1 physical attack with the rest of the team being all special which is something you'll definitely notice trying to break through spdef mons like spdef golem or t-wave Audino. The loss of status in toxic also doesn't really help with wearing bulky mons or walls down.

 

[MZ]

Ok, wasn't gonna rate since two people had but since neither really did it I'll see if this one works out a bit more. What they said about weaknesses and the like apply, but I think there's a better way to handle them. btw sorry if the formatting doesnt look so good, I wanted to get this out there since I promised it a while back.

First of all, I don't think Ice beam floatzel is necessary. You handle Quilladin and Tangela just fine, if you were weaker to them then maybe but I don't see much of a need for it. So instead try a set of Waterfall/Ice Punch/Aqua Jet/Power-Up Punch. This should let you clean up a lot better and jet is nice for scarf rotom and the like. The next change I have is trying offensive Chople Relicanth over Golem. Tank golem kind of loses momentum here, relicanth keeps up offensive pressure, still checks birds, and fares better vs Monferno and Machoke. Finally, Cryogonal really has been the weakest link on the team the whole time, it's a fast Ice-type presence that leaves you weaker to things like Jumpluff and generally fast things. I think your best option is swapping it out for Scarf Rotom-F to better handle just about everything really. You don't need its hazard support and rotom comes with pivoting, speed, etc. Hopefully these all help out and make sense, webs is still a difficult playstyle with some matchup issues so ideally this mitigates most of them for you.

sets

Floatzel @ Life Orb
Ability: Water Veil
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
IVs: 29 HP
- Waterfall
- Power-Up Punch
- Ice Punch
- Aqua Jet

Relicanth @ Chople Berry
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Head Smash
- Waterfall
- Zen Headbutt

Rotom-Frost @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Blizzard
- Will-O-Wisp (good for pawniard but you can do HP ice or somth if it doesnt get used)

 

[ManOfMany]

Hi RivalET! Nice team, and Sticky webs are good.

Out of all the changes, I like Anty's the best. It completely fixes your major Jumpluff weakness, and gives you great leverage vs Scarf Rotom-F and Scarf Mime.

However, I believe that Anty's version of the team still isn't good enough. Cryogonal doesn't fit well there as it invites dangerous wallbreakers in like Monferno and Machoke that you are totally unprepared for, and you don't really need Rapid Spin without a rocks weak mon. In addition, it makes you SUPER weak to priority (like seriously, you are just swept by Basculin and Dusknoir). Therefore I suggest you drop Cryo and instead...

Replace it with Floatzel. Physical Floatzel set would be the best, such as the set you already have, or a CB set could be good because it won't be worn down so easily from LO recoil.

The new team would look like:

There is also another path you could go with the team, however with Golem instead of Metang though (I would choose a more offensive Golem though). Keeping Zebstrika, though with Sap Sipper instead for Jumpluff, you have a variety of offensive options to use in place of Cryogonal, because your team is covered well defensively then.

CM Grumpig is really nice on webs and gives you a nice check to Monferno and Scarf Mr.Mime.

Basculin gives you an additional, very useful priority, and sits on a nice speed tier for webs.

Simisage is also nice there as it gives you a water resist for use against Scarf Simipour and Scarf Floatzel and takes advantage of webs really nicely. Nasty Plot would be especially nice. Although you will probably want HP rock or Rock Slide for Articuno.

#1:

#2:

#3:

Basically the most important thing is Zebstrika fits really well on your team, and it frees up a lot of options for you either with Lightningrod or Sap Sipper