Pokemon TCG (Trading Card Game)

Hi everybody! A couple months ago, I wanted to re-start the Pokemon TCG stuff on Smogon, since Smogon is Pokemon university and I believe that Smogon should be all-rounded. So, I talked with some people, and saw that a TCG room was made on main and I thought of making a sub-thread and talked it over with TheMantyke :).

So first off, to introduce myself. I'm OnlyLove, I'm a relatively new member to the Smogon forums, and I battle meh. I have played TCG for a while now, playing at Canadian Nats (I sucked), and kind of just playing at some local tournaments. Although, I don't travel around for TCG anymore, I still love the game and still I follow along with it.

Now onto the TCG stuffs. So since, Smogon's playerbase doesn't have many TCGers, and has more VGCers (or people who just battle in tiers), most of this post will be for the beginners (don't worry, I'll post more for advance stuff later.) I'm going to split this post into half; Beginners and more Advanced.

Beginners
So new to Pokemon TCG, and/or TCG in general? Don't fret, there are many resources out there where you can learn how to play the game. Also, you can ask around the Smogon community of TCG players as well. So, Pokemon TCG is a Trading Card Game, that involves 2 players (for a game). Here is a set of videos that I found helpful, for beginners.

Jwittz Part 1 (Learn how to play TCG)
Jwittz Part 2 (How to collect)

There are many Youtubers out there that play Pokemon TCG, and they play VERY well. Need more help? Ask in the comments or ask me via PM or ask around.

Common Q&As
Q: How are the starter theme decks on the shelves on many stores?
A: The starter theme decks are a good way to start learning the game, and to play your first couple of matches. However, if competing in anything competitive, the starter deck will get beat very badly. Its worth buying if you are new to the game and you want to learn how to play. :)

Q: How viable is each card? Can people use their favorite Pokemon to make a deck?
A: Unfortunately, many cards aren't viable in the metagame currently. However, some cards that may not seem viable can be used to create deck called a "rogue deck." These decks are basically cards that aren't seen, or are seen rarely being used to make a deck. Ask around, I love making Rogue decks, and sometimes they are VERY good. BUT if you aren't playing competitively and you want to make a deck with your favorite Pokemon, feel free to :)

Q: Is there a tierlist for decks?
A: No, there isn't, but I will be posting something similar to a tierlist for common decks soon :D.

Q: Any forum where there are articles on Pokemon?
A: Sixprizes is a GREAT place for Articles.

Anymore questions? Ask in the comment section :D

Advanced
So, now in the advanced part. I'm going to guess this group is from the players who know how to play the game to really competitive players. Advanced players already know how to play the game, so other than that it would really come down to discussion about competitive decks and strategies to play the game.

The only real TCG simulator that really works (without downloading anything or paying anything) is Playtcg and Bebesearch. Playtcg is the actual simulator, while Bebesearch is the website that you would use to register and build your deck on.


That concludes the OP, discuss in the comments about upcoming sets, decks, decklists, tournaments, whatever you want related to TCG :D. Of course I will be discussing as well. I will most likely take the first post of this to post a couple decks that are viable currently. Look out for that as well, as that will be constantly switching. It may contain a couple decklists :3.

Thanks guys!
 
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Youtubers that Pokemon TCG players can/should watch: The Top Cut (More competitive players, starring Pokemon TCG stars such as Kyle "Pooka" Succevich ,I dunno how u spell his last name), TheJwittz (from basic to competitive starring Joshua Wittenkeller , lol same thing these last names tho), these two are the two biggest Youtubers I would recommend :)

(BCR-Furious Fists) *UPDATED!!!!* some of this is in my opinion
Tier 1 Decks (Good decks imo. Most viable decks in the format.)
Virizion EX /Genesect EX
Blastoise / Keldeo EX / Black Kyurem EX
Landorus EX/ Raichu / Friends :D
Seismitoad EX / Garbador
Lucario EX / Landorus EX / Baby Landorus / Machamp

Tier 2 Decks (Pretty viable in competitive play, some tournaments have been won with these decks.)
Thundurus EX / Deoxys EX / Lugia EX
Thundurus EX / Deoxys EX / Lugia EX / Snorlax
Thundurus EX / Deoxys EX / Kyurem
Yvettal EX / Darkrai EX
Yvettal EX / Darkrai EX / Garbador

Tier 3 Decks (Kind of viable in competitive play, although, bad, but not bad.)
(i dun even know -_- nothing other than those decks are even slightly viable :( )

Which decklist do you want to see first? Put in the comment section, I'll start working on the decklist with most votes!

RESERVED for decklists and such :)
 
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So I open my first two booster packs ever, both Legendary Treasures. Inside I get so many people I wanted,
Croagunk
Misdreavus (I love me my ghosts)
Victini (Victory star has saved me)
Snivy (I know, I know, but it can beat charizard in TVG XD)

As I look through the last few cards, a sparkle catches my eye, it was an EX card, MEW EX.
My FIRST EVER pulls, and I get this crazy rare card. (What makes it all the more ironic is I never use it LOL)
 

Hulavuta

keeps the varmints on the run
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
I've always been interested in the card game and was always a fan of the art. I did play when I was in elementary school (with the real rules even!) but obviously never at a competitive level. I'm probably not going to get into the actual cards (although I'd like to) simply because I'm strapped for cash and I'm using most of my Pokemon time to get good at the video game, but I do have some questions that I think a lot of people new to the game are also probably thinking of.

First, how good are the starter theme decks? I know that they are complete decks and technically playable, but can a new player have decent success, not at a seriously high competitive level, but enough to learn the ins and outs of the game? Basically, is it worth sticking with an "off the shelf" deck for a while or is getting new cards and building off of it pretty much mandatory straightaway?

The bigger question I think most people have is: how well is the viability of cards and strategies distributed? Are most Pokemon and strategies viable? I know most people would like to use their favorites, and it's always easier to make the support that certain strategies need with card games. You've posted a lot of useful resources in the OP, but I wonder is there some sort of tier list? Not in the Smogon way of having separate metagames determined by tiers, but just a list of strategies considered most viable. I know in Magic: The Gathering the decklists of tournament winners are often published, is there anything like that for Pokemon? It seems like it'd be very useful to a new player.

Sorry if I derailed the thread with these newbie questions, but I think a lot of people new to the game are wondering the same things ^^;
 
The theme decks are really horrendous, to be honest. They contain too many Pokémon and Energy to provide good insight into how Pokémon is played competitively. They have like a 20/20/20 distribution of Pokémon/Trainers/Energy, whereas competitive decks are closer to 10/40/10. I would buy maybe one if I was starting out, just to get my hands on some cards to make a legal deck out of, and then start buying some staples from a site like TrollAndToad.

Here's a good list of cards you need for a lot of standard decks.

4x Professor Juniper OR Professor Sycamore
4x N
4x Ultra Ball
4x Colress*
4x Skyla
4x Rare Candy
3x Muscle Band
1x Professor's Letter
1x Sacred Ash
2x Startling Megaphone
4x Double Colorless Energy
1x Computer Search/Dowsing Machine**

* Few decks actually play 4 Colress, but it's a cheap card so you might as well get four when you're buying.
** These two cards are ACE Specs. You can only play one ACE Spec in your deck, so you don't really need to purchase more than one to make one good deck, but it's nice to have options.

The best Pokémon in the game are (for the most part) the fancy looking Pokémon EX that usually have around 170-180 HP. They are relatively rare and thus harder to get and/or more expensive. Some of them are a lot cheaper than others. Examples of good EXes that have been released through tins and other ways (making them easier on the wallet) are Yveltal EX, Darkrai EX, Mewtwo EX, Thundurus EX, Deoxys EX and Lugia EX. More expensive but good ones include Landorus EX, Virizion EX and Genesect EX.
 
The theme decks are really horrendous, to be honest. They contain too many Pokémon and Energy to provide good insight into how Pokémon is played competitively. They have like a 20/20/20 distribution of Pokémon/Trainers/Energy, whereas competitive decks are closer to 10/40/10. I would buy maybe one if I was starting out, just to get my hands on some cards to make a legal deck out of, and then start buying some staples from a site like TrollAndToad.

Here's a good list of cards you need for a lot of standard decks.

4x Professor Juniper OR Professor Sycamore
4x N
4x Ultra Ball
4x Colress*
4x Skyla
4x Rare Candy
3x Muscle Band
1x Professor's Letter
1x Sacred Ash
2x Startling Megaphone
4x Double Colorless Energy
1x Computer Search/Dowsing Machine**

* Few decks actually play 4 Colress, but it's a cheap card so you might as well get four when you're buying.
** These two cards are ACE Specs. You can only play one ACE Spec in your deck, so you don't really need to purchase more than one to make one good deck, but it's nice to have options.

The best Pokémon in the game are (for the most part) the fancy looking Pokémon EX that usually have around 170-180 HP. They are relatively rare and thus harder to get and/or more expensive. Some of them are a lot cheaper than others. Examples of good EXes that have been released through tins and other ways (making them easier on the wallet) are Yveltal EX, Darkrai EX, Mewtwo EX, Thundurus EX, Deoxys EX and Lugia EX. More expensive but good ones include Landorus EX, Virizion EX and Genesect EX.
thanks for having this. In my opinion though, theme decks are a good way to start the game. I'll also start posting decks and stuff in the 1st post :]
 
Can we post analysis of our decks? Just from a for-fun perspective. I only play casually, so I don't know much about competitive play.
 
One prime strategy I use: Choosing who you attach energy to.
Since you can only attach energy to a pokemon each turn, you might have only one pokemon able to attack at a time, making it difficult if this pokemon is KOed, to avoid this problem when low on energy in my hand, I evenly distribute my energy according to priority:
  1. Pokemon who can get me more energy: It takes careful planning to determine when to rack up heavy damage or to set up. Once I have a few free turns, I send in someone with an attack that gives my energy (Musharna from Mind Wipe for example.) And stay in, getting more and more energy until she gets KOed. The opponent will be regretting letting you set up when you bring in a powerful sweeper and nuke their team.
  2. 'Mons with large energy requirements: Power up, sweep through their team while I power someone else up, repeat.
  3. 'Mons with low energy requirements: After your powerful attacker weakens them, bring in a weaker 'mon, luring in their weaker 'mons (or getting in chip damage.), switch back into your powerful attacker, destroy them in a single hit.
I always distribute my energy so that each person has the energy they require to attack -1, that way, I can simply bring them in, attach an energy, then attack.
(More on luring later)
 
How have you guys been enjoying the new format? I haven't played since Nxd-XY since I was away from my league for most of the summer, but I just got back into the swing of things with the card game. I'm sad to see my precious dark patch and previous-to-others-but-I-really-don't-care-too-much Sableye going, but I think Yveltal is still pretty strong. I'm running a Garbodor list of it for the first time since Pyroar and Virgen are not fun when you can't blaze through them. I've been enjoying it a lot. Outside of rotated cards and the addition of the Garbodor line, I've also cut my list to a single Darkrai and dropped absol altogether. Darkrai is a clunky sort of alternate attacker, but I mainly get mileage out of him for games where I don't want to shut down abilities. I'm finding absol much, much harder to power up without dark patch. With that, it's fragility, the fighting weakness, and what feels like smaller benches, I haven't made much use of it.

Here's the list I'm using. Feel free to critique it, I'm pretty much a novice when it comes to the TCG.
3 Yveltal EX
2 Yveltal
1 Darkrai EX
2 Trubbish LTR
2 Garbodor LTR
1 Druddigon FF

4 Sycamore
4 N
2 Colress
3 Skyla
2 Lysandre
1 Pal Pad
2 Bicycle

3 Muscle Band
3 Float Stone
4 Hypnotoxic Laser
2 Virbank City Gym
4 Ultra Ball
1 Switch
1 Professor's Letter
1 Energy Switch
1 Dowsing Machine

7 Dark
4 DCE

The only match up where I feel like I have a disadvantage is when Raichu's tagging along with something. Everything else feels mostly even or 55/45 45/55. Thoughts on any alternate attackers that might be worth running for Raichu?
 

dwarfstar

mindless philosopher
TheMantyke My first instinct is to say you're pretty low on Energy, but I'm not sure what to switch out to make room for more, so take it with a grain of salt. Outside of that, it looks good to go.

As far as my own experiences go, Standard has mostly been pretty interesting. I don't have money to get the remaining cards that I need IRL, so I only have about half of a functioning deck, but I've been playing a lot on TCGO with a Grass deck (list below). Most of the time it works pretty well, even against Fire decks and those godawful Lucario-EX monstrosities that came with the new expansion, but it's held back somewhat by my limited supply of cards that would actually work with it (real or online, I almost never find decent cards in a pack). I'm also really going to miss Carnivine when the new rotation takes effect; Lure Poison has been ridiculously useful as a disruptive tool. For anyone else out there thinking of running a Grass deck, USE FURIOUS FISTS EEVEE AND PLASMA FREEZE LEAFEON. Being able to get Leafeon out there on the first turn puts immediate pressure on opponents, which you can hopefully keep up until you can get Virizion-EX and Genesect-EX/Venusaur-EX onto the field to start setting up (and even mid-game, having faster access to Leafeon allows you to more easily punish the foe for getting a lot of Energy out there). Also, invest in Shaymin-EX. The low HP kinda holds it back, but it's a very useful comeback mon late-game. One more thing to remember, regardless of what kind of deck you plan on running: Lysandre is the most obnoxious card in existence.

2x Eevee (Furious Fists 80)
2x Leafeon (Plasma Freeze)
1x Shaymin-EX
1x Venusaur-EX
1x Mega-Venusaur-EX (Virizion-EX actually makes this somewhat usable, and it wrecks if you can set it up)
2x Treecko
2x Grovyle
2x Sceptile
1x Virizion-EX
1x Carnivine (to be switched out once the new rotation takes effect)

2x Energy Switch
2x Escape Rope
2x Evosoda
2x Ultra Ball
1x Master Ball
2x Professor's Letter
1x Startling Megaphone
2x Hard Charm
1x Muscle Band
2x Hypnotoxic Laser
1x Virbank City Gym
1x N (to be switched out once the new rotation takes effect)
2x Colress
2x Shauna
2x Pokemon Fan Club
2x Pokemon Center Lady

2x Double Colorless Energy
2x Herbal Energy
14x Grass Energy

If you've got any suggestions for how to improve the deck, please let me know.
 
dwarfstar I don't mean to be rude, but to be honest with you, your deck looks really bad. If you want to be able to consistently draw into what you need, you need to have a good draw engine of supports going. The format standard is 4 Juniper, 4 N (which was reprinted as a league promo and is still legal in this format, and a few extra Colress or maybe Shauna. I'd heavily recommend playing fewer trainers in thicker lines to be able to consistently get what you need, with maybe a handful of situationally useful 1 off cards. You should also narrow down your Pokemon line into what's really useful for you. Sceptile is a bad card for the amount of set up you go through; an Yveltal with a dark and a dce, a pyroar with a muscle band, and a whole host of other things can take it down very easily after committing a lot of resources to set it up. You'd be much better off with something like a thicker line of Virizion, Genesect EX, or even something like a line of Raichu. Your Energy count is also a bit too high. Energy is usually only about 10-14 cards.
 
TheMantyke yep thats enough energy for sure.

3 Yveltal EX
2 Yveltal --> 3 Yvettal
1 Darkrai EX --> 2 Darkrai EX
2 Trubbish LTR
2 Garbodor LTR
1 Druddigon FF

4 Sycamore
4 N --> 3 N
2 Colress
3 Skyla
2 Lysandre --> 1 Lysandre
1 Pal Pad
2 Bicycle

3 Muscle Band
3 Float Stone --> 2 Float Stone
4 Hypnotoxic Laser --> 3 Hypnotoxic Laser
2 Virbank City Gym
4 Ultra Ball --> 3 Ultra Ball
1 Switch
1 Professor's Letter
1 Energy Switch --> 3 Energy Switch
1 Dowsing Machine

7 Dark --> 8 Dark
4 DCE --> 3 DCE


I guess I will explain the changes. The baby yvettal addition is for that energy recycle. It acts as a Dark Patch. Darkrai is for... Well its Darkrai. It provides free retreat for the early turns when garbador isn't up. It also provides a GREAT attack! Don't see why you would only run 1 in your deck. Moving on to Supporters, N is basically a double edged sword. You could kill yourself in the late game. Lysandre is a catcher, yes its useful, but when u see that card in your hand with no other supporter u kinda :(. So its a gamble basically kinda like N, but worse. 3 Float Stone is not needed, because you have Muscle Band. Remember you have more Yvettal EX than Garbador, and you basically have free retreat from Darkrai. Laser is a awesome card, but not always useful. Ultra Ball is a lot worse without Dark Patch.... Energy Switch is a staple for those KOs that your opponent can't forsee. Energy is just kind of more standard stuff. :] hope i helped.
 
dwarfstar your deck, needs a lot of polishing...
dwarfstar I don't mean to be rude, but to be honest with you, your deck looks really bad. If you want to be able to consistently draw into what you need, you need to have a good draw engine of supports going. The format standard is 4 Juniper, 4 N (which was reprinted as a league promo and is still legal in this format, and a few extra Colress or maybe Shauna. I'd heavily recommend playing fewer trainers in thicker lines to be able to consistently get what you need, with maybe a handful of situationally useful 1 off cards. You should also narrow down your Pokemon line into what's really useful for you. Sceptile is a bad card for the amount of set up you go through; an Yveltal with a dark and a dce, a pyroar with a muscle band, and a whole host of other things can take it down very easily after committing a lot of resources to set it up. You'd be much better off with something like a thicker line of Virizion, Genesect EX, or even something like a line of Raichu. Your Energy count is also a bit too high. Energy is usually only about 10-14 cards.
As Mantyke said, you don't have many staples that keep your deck running. Energy isn't TOOOO important. I ran a deck that only had 4 energy. So don't worry lol. Anyways I'll work on your deck later :] dwdw :] if you need help I can help just inbox me or post :D
 

dwarfstar

mindless philosopher
dwarfstar I don't mean to be rude, but to be honest with you, your deck looks really bad. If you want to be able to consistently draw into what you need, you need to have a good draw engine of supports going. The format standard is 4 Juniper, 4 N (which was reprinted as a league promo and is still legal in this format, and a few extra Colress or maybe Shauna. I'd heavily recommend playing fewer trainers in thicker lines to be able to consistently get what you need, with maybe a handful of situationally useful 1 off cards. You should also narrow down your Pokemon line into what's really useful for you. Sceptile is a bad card for the amount of set up you go through; an Yveltal with a dark and a dce, a pyroar with a muscle band, and a whole host of other things can take it down very easily after committing a lot of resources to set it up. You'd be much better off with something like a thicker line of Virizion, Genesect EX, or even something like a line of Raichu. Your Energy count is also a bit too high. Energy is usually only about 10-14 cards.
I'll alter the Trainer lineup, for sure. The trouble with the actual Pokemon in the deck is that I just don't have very many cards that work with this deck - if there's one of a given card in this deck, it's because I have no more of them. Most of the mons I've pulled so far have been weak enough that they give less benefit for the setup cost than Sceptile, with the notable exception of a Chandelure-EX and Toxicroak-EX from an old Grass/Psy deck I used to run and an Yveltal-EX that's just lying around. I'll see what I can do about improving on what I've got, though. Thanks for the advice!
 
Yveltal Decks are kind of dead right now, when its all said and done those are previous tiers, yveltal lacks the speed it used to have with dark patch. There really are no Tiers set in stone yet, its still pre-rotation.
 
KidDracula oh jeez, I've had this argument with someone. Is Yvettal still good? Damn right its still good. With Baby Yvettal the power keeps on going steadily, if you run consistently enough. Although Yvettal does lose Sableye, and Dark Patch, it makes room for more Baby Yvettal and cards that make the deck run smoother. Dark Patch could have been a curse in the early game if you didn't have anything in your discard. It was just another dead card. Sableye on the other hand, was somewhat important in NXD-on, less important than when it was BW-on. In BCR-on a lot of extremely useful cards such as Enhanced Hammer has rotated out.
 

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