Pokémon Empoleon

Gaboswampert

Gaboswampert

Screenshot_20230913_190241.jpg

Type: Water/Steel
Base Stats: 84/86/88/111/101/60 (530)
Abilities: Torrent | Competitive
Notable Moves:
-Hydro Pump
-Surf
-Flash Cannon
-Air Slash
-Grass Knot
-Stealth Rock
-Agility
-Ice Beam
-Knock Off
-Vacuum Wave
-Flip Turn
-Yawn
-Roost
-Tera Blast
Pros:
  • Good offensive type and amazing defensive type
  • Competitive makes it very threatening, since any mon trying to remove its Stealth Rock/hazards with Defog will have to give it a +2 SpAtk boost, as well as helping on its matchups against Intimidate users
  • Access to Stealth Rocks, its also a very effective hazard setter since it deters the use of Defog cus it has Competitive, it also resists said Stealth Rocks
  • Good utility moves in Yawn, Knock Off, recovery in Roost and pivoting with Flip Turn
  • Its unique typing and ability lets it pair well with top meta mons like Rillaboom, Great Tusk, Dragapult, Iron Valiant, Samurott-Hisui, Enamorus, Landorus-T, Moltres and Zama-H
  • Has many sets to choose from
  • Water (Hydro Pump/Surf), Ice (Ice Beam) and Grass (Grass Knot) is an unresisted offensive combo
  • 2+ Hydro Pump hits decently hard
Cons:
  • Lackluster defenses, especially its physical defense, which mitigates its plethora of resistances
  • Low speed, which hurts it even more because of its low defenses
  • If it doesnt invest in speed, it loses to arguably the best and one of the most used mons on OU, Great Tusk
  • It doesnt have as much coverage as many special attackers in OU, nor as many utility tools as the many walls/stall mons in OU
Tera Potentials:
Empoleon doesnt really wanna terastalize, since its great, unique type, is one of its main favorable points, but if it has to, it has good options
Grass:
Tera Grass changes its weakness to Ground and Electric into a resistance, and its Fighting weakness into a neutrality, it also gets a more consistant Grass type coverage move
Ground:
Tera Ground turns its Electric weakness into an inmunity, which makes it able to switch into Volt Switches, as well as its Ground and Fighting type weakness into a neutrality, it also gets a way to hit Steel types superefectively
Flying:
Changes its weakness to Fighting into a resistance, and its weakness to Ground into an inmunity, changing its matchup into Great Tusk, Landorus-T, and the many other OU ground types favorably, but keeps its Electric weakness and gets a Stealth Rock weakness as a downside

Sets:

Hazard Setter/Defensive Pivot
Empoleon @ Leftovers
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground / Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Bold Nature
- Flip Turn / Roost / Yawn
- Roost / Knock Off / Flip Turn
- Stealth Rock
- Hydro Pump

Defensive
Empoleon @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
Tera Type: Flying / Ground / Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature / Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Flip Turn
- Yawn / Stealth Rock
- Roost

Offensive
Empoleon @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature / Modest Nature
- Flip Turn
- Grass Knot / Air Slash / Flash Cannon
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump / Surf

Life Orb
Empoleon @ Life Orb
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground / Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Flip Turn
- Roost
- Ice Beam / Grass Knot / Flash Cannon
- Hydro Pump

Assault Vest
Empoleon @ Assault Vest
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground / Grass
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 SpDef
Modest Nature
- Flip Turn
- Grass Knot / Air Slash / Tera Blast / Flash Cannon
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump
Can also run max HP or Def instead of max SpDef

Im happy it got some buffs :)
 
Last edited:

Dragonite4242

To add on to this, I think spdef empoleon has potential now with the addition of roost. For example, Roost, knock off, haze, surf could be a decent set at checking booster energy walking wake on ho, as well as tail glow/take heart manaphy. Roost also lets it pivot in on shadow balls from pult much more easily.
 
bodi

bodi

Banned deucer.
I am happy that it got some good buffs, good analyse i can't complain that much but I would love if you add flash canon to the offensive set :woop:
 
Loginator

Loginator

Gaboswampert said:
View attachment 551476
Type: Water/Steel
Base Stats: 84/86/88/111/101/60 (530)
Abilities: Torrent | Competitive
Notable Moves:
-Hydro Pump
-Surf
-Flash Cannon
-Air Slash
-Grass Knot
-Stealth Rock
-Ice Beam
-Knock Off
-Vacuum Wave
-Flip Turn
-Yawn
-Roost
-Tera Blast
Pros:
  • Good offensive type and amazing defensive type
  • Competitive makes it very threatening, since any mon trying to remove its Stealth Rock/hazards with Defog will have to give it a +2 SpAtk boost, as well as helping on its matchups against Intimidate users
  • Access to Stealth Rocks, its also a very effective hazard setter since it deters the use of Defog cus it has Competitive, it also resists said Stealth Rocks
  • Good utility moves in Yawn, Knock Off, recovery in Roost and pivoting with Flip Turn
  • Its unique typing and ability lets it pair well with top meta mons like Rillaboom, Great Tusk, Dragapult, Iron Valiant, Samurott-Hisui, Enamorus, Landorus-T, Moltres and Zama-H
  • Water (Hydro Pump/Surf), Ice (Ice Beam) and Grass (Grass Knot) is an unresisted offensive combo
  • 2+ Hydro Pump hits decently hard
Cons:
  • Very lackluster defenses, which severely mitigates its plethora of resistances
  • Low speed, which hurts it even more because of its low defenses
  • If it doesnt invest in speed, it loses to arguably the best and one of the most used mons on OU, Great Tusk
  • It doesnt have as much coverage as many special attackers in OU, nor as many utility tools as the many walls/stall mons in OU
Tera Potentials:
Empoleon doesnt really wanna terastalize, since its great, unique type, is one of its main favorable points, but if it has to, it has good options
Grass:
Tera Grass changes its weakness to Ground and Electric into a resistance, and its Fighting weakness into a neutrality, it also gets a more consistant Grass type coverage move
Ground:
Tera Ground turns its Electric weakness into an inmunity, which makes it able to switch into Volt Switches, as well as its Ground and Fighting type weakness into a neutrality, it also gets a way to hit Steel types superefectively
Flying:
Changes its weakness to Fighting into a resistance, and its weakness to Ground into an inmunity, changing its matchup into Great Tusk, Landorus-T, and the many other OU ground types favorably, but keeps its Electric weakness and gets a Stealth Rock weakness as a downside

Sets:

Hazard Setter/Defensive Pivot
Empoleon @ Leftovers
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground / Grass
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Bold Nature
- Flip Turn / Roost / Yawn
- Roost / Knock Off / Flip Turn
- Stealth Rock
- Hydro Pump

Offensive
Empoleon @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature / Modest Nature
- Flip Turn
- Grass Knot / Air Slash / Flash Cannon
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump / Surf

Life Orb
Empoleon @ Life Orb
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground / Grass
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Flip Turn
- Roost
- Ice Beam / Grass Knot / Flash Cannon
- Hydro Pump

Assault Vest
Empoleon @ Assault Vest
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Flying / Ground / Grass
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Flip Turn
- Grass Knot / Air Slash / Tera Blast / Flash Cannon
- Ice Beam
- Hydro Pump

Im happy it got some buffs :)
Click to expand...
Why would this run max Defense instead of HP?
 
Gaboswampert

Gaboswampert

Loginator said:
Why would this run max Defense instead of HP?
Click to expand...
Why HP? Its defenses are kinda bad, so to make work of them it has to fully invest in at least one, i could see a case for SpDef, but with only max HP its still quite weak, im probably making a version of the defensive set without Competitive Hydro Pump so it runs max HP max Def/SpDef, but i never see it running max HP max SpAtk
 

Dragonite4242

By investing in HP, you're increasing your overall bulk by a lot more than if you just invest in one of the defenses, even if that causes your bulk for that defense to be higher. Since empoleon isn't a pokemon that has such a low defense stat, like 40 for example, investing more in defense doesn't give you much more bulk on the physical end than max hp, while sacrificing all that spdef bulk max hp gives you.
 
Gaboswampert

Gaboswampert

Ok, i can see the points, changed most of the sets to have max HP instead of max Def/SpDef exept AV since that one prefers to have max SpDef, but put that it has the option to be max HP
 
SapphSabre777

SapphSabre777

There's a lot of variability with Empoleon this generation, thanks to the myriad of moveset buffs. It'll have a lot of 4MSS involved with both offensive and defensive sets, but it's much more variable and able than in past generations. Keep in mind this is just theorizing rather than in-play experience, so my opinions may or may not be moot due to lack of application.

One move I'm surprised no one has mentioned is Agility. Without investment, you get 312 at +2 with a Neutral Speed Nature, which outspeeds unboosted Jolly Lando-T, Tusk. With more investment, you can outspeed +Spe Dragapult and +1 85 'mons like Mamo and Nite (as examples), which would allow for Empoleon (namely offensive variants) to compete against certain threats leaning to play around its 60 Speed unboosted. Hypothetically you could run Timid with Agility, but you'd miss out on key OHKO calcs that Modest provides.

Again, just a theorization, but I wanted to speak up on the possibilities.
 
Cobalt Empoleon

Cobalt Empoleon

SapphSabre777 said:
There's a lot of variability with Empoleon this generation, thanks to the myriad of moveset buffs. It'll have a lot of 4MSS involved with both offensive and defensive sets, but it's much more variable and able than in past generations. Keep in mind this is just theorizing rather than in-play experience, so my opinions may or may not be moot due to lack of application.

One move I'm surprised no one has mentioned is Agility. Without investment, you get 312 at +2 with a Neutral Speed Nature, which outspeeds unboosted Jolly Lando-T, Tusk. With more investment, you can outspeed +Spe Dragapult and +1 85 'mons like Mamo and Nite (as examples), which would allow for Empoleon (namely offensive variants) to compete against certain threats leaning to play around its 60 Speed unboosted. Hypothetically you could run Timid with Agility, but you'd miss out on key OHKO calcs that Modest provides.

Again, just a theorization, but I wanted to speak up on the possibilities.
Click to expand...
I agree. I suspect a lot of Empoleon's value in the new meta will come from uncertainty. A bulky set utilising its new defensive tools is likely to be the standard, but an offensive set could give the opponent a nasty surprise.
 
Blaze_101392

Blaze_101392

Why -ATK natures on the defensive set when it only has physical moves? Granted neither are really used for damage, but if you're not using your special attack might as well put the negative there.
 

nameless90

Don't underlook the fact that Empoleon has access to Agility as a boosting move to rectify it low base Spe to a decent level. Empoleon may have a middling Def, but thanks to its typing, it has many opportunities to set-up.
 
Pipotchi

Pipotchi

is a Top Artistis a CAP Contributor
ngl I dont expect empoleon to stay around in ou. but a spdef set with haze seems like the best way to make use of its unique qualities. in most cases its going to be better to have toxapex or someone else, but its a mon who can wall walking wake/dragapult a bit and stave off cresselia and clangorous kommo-o (and maybe manaphy if youre lucky..).

probably something like this:
Empoleon @ Leftovers
Ability: Competitive
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Roost
- Haze
- Ice Beam
- Knock Off / Stealth Rock

the water stab felt awkward since it didnt do much of anything into the mons i would want this to handle, so i went for ice beam for a mix of hitting targets as well as hazard removal. overall, slots remain awkward though
 
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